Forums > Windsurfing General

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
21 Aug 2018 9:49PM
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Not that it seems to be a performance issue , and I love the sail , but it does give me the shi.ts , that the cams don't completly snap around all the way immediately . They kind of hang there 95 % of the way. Sometimes they pop a few seconds into the run and sometimes not at all. If I'm blasting along and push a back off I can get them to pop but that's a bit ****,ty . I can't tell the difference in performance if they have poped or not. I have four different sizes and there all the same. All proper masts . From mild to wild downhaul doesn't seem to make any difference.
I love the simplicity of the new cams apposed to the over complex , fragile but smooth older version .
Am i alone , any advice.

Orange Whip
QLD, 485 posts
24 Aug 2018 10:52PM
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No replies IMAX, probably because no one else can afford four new V8's

For what it's worth here's my 0.5 cent's worth.

I don't have a new V8, although I did try to get an 8.7 but they couldn't supply, so I bought an Ezzy Lion instead. However, I have sailed 7 batten, 2 cam NP older model V6's and the only time I've had trouble with the cams rotating is if underpowered for the size of the sail. If you gybe and they don't rotate completely, one decent pump will complete the rotation. I disagree that you can't notice the difference in the performance if they are sitting half rotated, the sail feels retarded half rotated as you,don't have full profile available.

If it's any consolation, contrary to the hype, overall I don't rate the rotation of my 2 cam Ezzy any better than my NP's.

No matter what niggling irritations there might be with a NP sail the overall performance makes you fall in love with them. And BTW my Ezzy is a PITA to rig compared to my NP's.

If you've got an 8.7 V8 In as new condition I'll swap you for my 2018 8.5 Lion

Maddlad
WA, 289 posts
25 Aug 2018 8:45AM
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Yep, I had the NP Hornets which are now the V8's and I now use full NP race sails. They all have the same issue when rotating, and one pump usually gets them fully round for me. I use 100% carbon race masts (NP) and I can definitely feel it if they're not fully around because I don't accelerate properly.

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
25 Aug 2018 4:37PM
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Its not like other sails that don't pop all the way which kinda go around 80% and theres a big clunk still to go . On mine its probably more than 95% and its only a small click to go all the way . Mabee 5mm movement where the batten ends . There would be bugger all profile change . Its hard to tell while sailing but I would also think there is no movement while sailing , it seems to be locked in . Its just that last ****teenth . Batten tension doesn't seem to help . Pumping on the odd occasion works . It would be nice if they worked perfectly like on the EVOs.
Still hoping someone has my sails with the perfect answer like chop 100mm off the front end of the batten and extend 100mm on the rear ( to make them stiffer ) , (or the other way around ) , if that would help or something like that.???

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
25 Aug 2018 7:36PM
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Orange Whip said..
No replies IMAX, probably because no one else can afford four new V8's

For what it's worth here's my 0.5 cent's worth.

I don't have a new V8, although I did try to get an 8.7 but they couldn't supply, so I bought an Ezzy Lion instead. However, I have sailed 7 batten, 2 cam NP older model V6's and the only time I've had trouble with the cams rotating is if underpowered for the size of the sail. If you gybe and they don't rotate completely, one decent pump will complete the rotation. I disagree that you can't notice the difference in the performance if they are sitting half rotated, the sail feels retarded half rotated as you,don't have full profile available.

If it's any consolation, contrary to the hype, overall I don't rate the rotation of my 2 cam Ezzy any better than my NP's.

No matter what niggling irritations there might be with a NP sail the overall performance makes you fall in love with them. And BTW my Ezzy is a PITA to rig compared to my NP's.

If you've got an 8.7 V8 In as new condition I'll swap you for my 2018 8.5 Lion



Windsurf Perth has a 7.7 for $745 , that's about 10 cents per cubic cm,
Is it for sale cos the cams don't completely click all the time ?

Orange Whip
QLD, 485 posts
25 Aug 2018 8:45PM
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Yeah saw that and thought the same thing. They had a s/h 6.7 as well yesterday but I notice it has gone off the b&s today.

Isn't that Hudson dude based down your way? Isn't he Australia's Mr. Pryde? Why don't you ask him what the go is?

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
25 Aug 2018 9:02PM
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Orange Whip said..
Yeah saw that and thought the same thing. They had a s/h 6.7 as well yesterday but I notice it has gone off the b&s today.

Isn't that Hudson dude based down your way? Isn't he Australia's Mr. Pryde? Why don't you ask him what the go is?

Yes he is , and your right , and I bought three out of four from him , and we know each other , god dam your a genius , I'll do it Monday . I suppose I'm only talking about it here is because easier and it's only a tiny click of an issue.
Ill get back to all concerned shortly.

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
25 Aug 2018 9:21PM
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Orange Whip said..
Yeah saw that and thought the same thing. They had a s/h 6.7 as well yesterday but I notice it has gone off the b&s today.

Isn't that Hudson dude based down your way? Isn't he Australia's Mr. Pryde? Why don't you ask him what the go is?


I think I'd like a 8.7 V8 , got a H2 8.7 and I think it's a good size , but it's powerful and not easy work . The 9.4 V8 is a friendly oaf . It's bending , creaky , and complaining when planing but works . The 8.2 knows what it's doing but I could do with more.
My problem is , all the glitter of new gear is outweighing the few skills I have.
Simple cure , need more time on water.

John340
QLD, 1874 posts
26 Aug 2018 11:32AM
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Try using Teflon or silica paste as a lubricant between the cam and the mast.

pepe47
WA, 1151 posts
26 Aug 2018 11:58AM
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Couldn't be a mast suitability, or downhaul problem could it?

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
26 Aug 2018 7:08PM
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The bigger sizes are older Np x6 then newer X9 and X100.
They work perfectly on newer NP Evos so I would think they are OK.
Downhaul makes a little difference but not much . I can downhaul so the crease almost goes to the mast but then it's lost so much power .

Shifu
QLD, 923 posts
26 Aug 2018 8:45PM
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You guys with non rotating cams, standard practice on the race circuit is to soak your sails in fish oil overnight before sailing for the first time. After that just need a top up soak every few weeks depending on usage. AA does this.

Subsonic
WA, 1410 posts
26 Aug 2018 6:55PM
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Shifu said..
You guys with non rotating cams, standard practice on the race circuit is to soak your sails in fish oil overnight before sailing for the first time. After that just need a top up soak every few weeks depending on usage. AA does this.


You and your frcken fishy smelling fins and whatnot.

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
27 Aug 2018 6:50PM
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Shifu said..
You guys with non rotating cams, standard practice on the race circuit is to soak your sails in fish oil overnight before sailing for the first time. After that just need a top up soak every few weeks depending on usage. AA does this.


I've been told to boil sail in Vaseline , will that work ? I buy the stuff in 20 litre tubs and always have plenty.

Shifu
QLD, 923 posts
27 Aug 2018 7:12PM
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Imax1 said..

I've been told to boil sail in Vaseline , will that work ? I buy the stuff in 20 litre tubs and always have plenty.


Mmmm, speaking of 20 lite tubs, an interesting thing happened to me in Tokyo back in the 90s. I was leaving the train station when I was approached by a large group of ... Ooops! Can't tell you that story!

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
27 Aug 2018 7:40PM
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Shifu said..

Imax1 said..

I've been told to boil sail in Vaseline , will that work ? I buy the stuff in 20 litre tubs and always have plenty.



Mmmm, speaking of 20 lite tubs, an interesting thing happened to me in Tokyo back in the 90s. I was leaving the train station when I was approached by a large group of ... Ooops! Can't tell you that story!


I always thought Ooops came in small groups.

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
6 Sep 2018 6:44PM
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Got a reply from NP directly and it seems everything I tried makes sense to them and they are still bamboozled.
It was suggested to try a new SPX or TPX mast rather than my older X6 and X9 .
This wont be easy.
Im also confused , I am led to be believed that all NP masts have the same curve , ( for ever ) , and the upper and lower carbon as well as the years all supposedly have the same curve . It says so in their brochures .
The masts I use work great on all other NP sails I have and have had.
So what gives ???
Either 1, the new masts have a different curve .
2 , im a chopper and im missing something , ( high probability )
or 3 , there is a problem .
Not that its a big problem but I did notice the other day way overpowered that the cam did not lock and it was moving. I couldn't tell the difference when it locked and when it didn't apart from the visuals I was getting.
Ill go hee for tiggy if they admit there is a issue.
That's why id like to talk to someone that actually owns a new V8. Its seems im the only one

Sparky
WA, 784 posts
6 Sep 2018 5:17PM
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Imax, the TPX is softer top than the older X9 to the point that when I bought one it just didn't work. I used old X9 in my KA race and they were/are perfect but the TPX is a different curve.
So, the TPX being different to the X9 may be what you are after?

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
6 Sep 2018 8:14PM
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^^^
Im getting that sinking feeling that I need 3 new masts .....YAY !
Or put up with it.
I mean how much equipment is still considered normal and healthy ?

MartinF2
QLD, 465 posts
6 Sep 2018 10:34PM
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You might also be surprised if you measure the different masts suggested and their diameters compared to what you have. They do change from year to year and this effects rotation if not matched. I have various different model NP masts over the years and they are different sizes. Maybe worth checking if you know someone with a newer one and some verniers.

Nelle
VIC, 38 posts
7 Sep 2018 6:45AM
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Imax1 said..
^^^
Im getting that sinking feeling that I need 3 new masts .....YAY !
Or put up with it.
I mean how much equipment is still considered normal and healthy ?


N+1 is the formula for how much gear is normal and healthy. Where N represents the amount of gear you currently own. Can be over ridden by by the formula N-1. Where N represents the amount of gear that will make your wife leave you.

ka43
NSW, 2760 posts
7 Sep 2018 7:53AM
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Imax, try a NP FX100 if you can.

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
7 Sep 2018 8:02AM
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Select to expand quote
Nelle said..

Imax1 said..
^^^
Im getting that sinking feeling that I need 3 new masts .....YAY !
Or put up with it.
I mean how much equipment is still considered normal and healthy ?



N+1 is the formula for how much gear is normal and healthy. Where N represents the amount of gear you currently own. Can be over ridden by by the formula N-1. Where N represents the amount of gear that will make your wife leave you.


What about N+ shhh , masts are easy to hide

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
7 Sep 2018 8:08AM
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ka43 said..
Imax, try a NP FX100 if you can.



I'm going to take them to my shop and rig them on new masts . I'll be able to tell straight away. If they flip perfect then my lack of sleep will make me decide which child I'll have to sell. I can't keep living with almost popped cams.

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
7 Sep 2018 7:16PM
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Select to expand quote
Imax1 said..

Nelle said..


Imax1 said..
^^^
Im getting that sinking feeling that I need 3 new masts .....YAY !
Or put up with it.
I mean how much equipment is still considered normal and healthy ?




N+1 is the formula for how much gear is normal and healthy. Where N represents the amount of gear you currently own. Can be over ridden by by the formula N-1. Where N represents the amount of gear that will make your wife leave you.



What about N+ shhh , masts are easy to hide


Fessed up just now , she said that's OK she just bought a new shirt today and didn't want to tell me.
Yeah that's a fair deal , A pole stick thing couldn't be that expensive , I think I'll keep her .
She knows , still going strong from when we were 17

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
10 Sep 2018 4:05PM
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I now know exactly whats going on .
Went to my shop and rigged up my mast and a new mast.
The older X6 masts dont work , the new ones do , perfectly.
Im not sure if the flex rates are different but on the new mast the top cam area is 5mm smaller diameter and the bottom the same. ( drop shape ) .
Its agreed in the shop im not spastic and it is the sail / masts.
Photos , videos and emails will go to NP.
A reason i chose these sails is because i had perfect condition X6 and X9 masts already and the NP brochure says my masts will work.
I wonder what the outcome will be ?
I wonder if NP will send me three new masts for free ????
I hope something good will happen

BSN101
WA, 1418 posts
10 Sep 2018 2:16PM
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Select to expand quote
Imax1 said..
I now know exactly whats going on .
Went to my shop and rigged up my mast and a new mast.
The older X6 masts dont work , the new ones do , perfectly.
Im not sure if the flex rates are different but on the new mast the top cam area is 5mm smaller diameter and the bottom the same. ( drop shape ) .
Its agreed in the shop im not spastic and it is the sail / masts.
Photos , videos and emails will go to NP.
A reason i chose these sails is because i had perfect condition X6 and X9 masts already and the NP brochure says my masts will work.
I wonder what the outcome will be ?
I wonder if NP will send me three new masts for free ????
I hope something good will happen


Nah,

2019 V8s with masts and X9 booms to sweeten the deal. lucky you! lol

MartinF2
QLD, 465 posts
10 Sep 2018 8:36PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Imax1 said..
I now know exactly whats going on .
Went to my shop and rigged up my mast and a new mast.
The older X6 masts dont work , the new ones do , perfectly.
Im not sure if the flex rates are different but on the new mast the top cam area is 5mm smaller diameter and the bottom the same. ( drop shape ) .
Its agreed in the shop im not spastic and it is the sail / masts.
Photos , videos and emails will go to NP.
A reason i chose these sails is because i had perfect condition X6 and X9 masts already and the NP brochure says my masts will work.
I wonder what the outcome will be ?
I wonder if NP will send me three new masts for free ????
I hope something good will happen


I think someone mentioned this further up

Imax1
VIC, 1554 posts
10 Sep 2018 8:46PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
MartinF2 said..


Imax1 said..
I now know exactly whats going on .
Went to my shop and rigged up my mast and a new mast.
The older X6 masts dont work , the new ones do , perfectly.
Im not sure if the flex rates are different but on the new mast the top cam area is 5mm smaller diameter and the bottom the same. ( drop shape ) .
Its agreed in the shop im not spastic and it is the sail / masts.
Photos , videos and emails will go to NP.
A reason i chose these sails is because i had perfect condition X6 and X9 masts already and the NP brochure says my masts will work.
I wonder what the outcome will be ?
I wonder if NP will send me three new masts for free ????
I hope something good will happen




I think someone mentioned this further up



You were spot on .
And it's a warning for anyone contemplating a new V8 , you have to buy a new mast also.

MartinF2
QLD, 465 posts
10 Sep 2018 10:38PM
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Select to expand quote
Imax1 said..
You were spot on .
And it's a warning for anyone contemplating a new V8 , you have to buy a new mast also.


Sadly from the same experience with EVO's

Orange Whip
QLD, 485 posts
23 Sep 2018 6:28PM
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So what about the other way round? I need to buy a new 430 but my 6.7 Hornet is 2013. Will new mast work with old sail?



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"NP V8" started by Imax1