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Newb - Crossover Board selection WS/Foiling

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Created by phxdude 27 days ago, 10 Jun 2020
phxdude
5 posts
10 Jun 2020 2:39AM
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Hey guys, Looking to get started in windsurfing/foiling. I have experience on a Laser type sailboat and extensive boating water sports including wakesurf foiling for 2 seasons behind a boat. I currently own the Slingshot Hoverglide Infinity 84 and 65 on the track mount.

I'm 210lbs (95kg) and will be using this on an inland lake that is typically ranges 8-15mph with the odd high wind days at 20+.

I'd like a cross over board that can be used to windsurf on and also foil. I can only afford 1 board at the ~$2000 price point, so it has to be able to do both. In my location there is zero used market to be had and no shops to demo anything. Basically, I have to roll the dice and hope whatever I order works and is compatible with the foil I already own.

So far I've narrowed down the options to:

2020 FANATIC FALCON LIGHTWIND (159L)
2020 SLINGSHOT LEVITATOR (160L)
2020 FANATIC GECKO FOIL (135L)
2020 JP HYDROFOIL (150L)
2020 FANATIC STINGRAY (140L)

The list could go on, but you get the idea. Is this class of boards a good place to start with room to grow? Any other crossover boards that I should know about? Is there a 'Best' for my application? Does the Slingshot Hoverglide foil series work with all of these with the DT adapter? Is a track mount preferred or a DT? I see some boards offer both...

Ideal first rig given these parameters? I was thinking of starting with a 4.0 and a 6.0 thinking I'd be able to learn mechanics of WSing in light conditions and eventually foil with those?

Will I be able to figure this sport out on these as an avid waterman, or do I really need a 200L+ yacht to learn on?

Thoughts/guidance? Thanks

Awalkspoiled
52 posts
11 Jun 2020 2:46AM
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I've sailed and/or foiled on the first three only so here are my limited thoughts. My own multi-purpose board is a 95cm slalom board similar in shape to the Starboard 147. I weigh 100kg:

Falcon Lightwind - fine for foiling with a Tuttle head and GREAT for light wind sailing with a fin and as big a sail as you own. The only issue is that the wind range is kinda similar. Once you're skilled you may be able to foil it in 8-9 but you'll be lit up on a fin in 12 and blown away in 22 except on really flat water. It's pretty wide so it's theoretically better suited to racier foils than the low-aspect lifty ones but I had an i84 under it and it was ok. Has a reputation for fragility which militates against learning on it, although it's very stable.

Levitator 160 - I haven't ridden it with a fin but it's super-easy to foil on for us heavyweights and it would give you the lowest lift-off speeds possible. I'd own one if I had room and money for it. Likely to suck with fins in those slots although I've heard of people trying it. Fine for learning the basics though. If you have the very short mast you could try it in the track-mount with no foil and it would get you through the basics I guess.

Gecko 135 Foil - probably the most versatile of the three because you can foil on it in 10 and not be ridiculously over-boarded with a 5.5 and a fin. In fact, with a good 6.2 or something you might able to have the unicorn - the one-sail/one board quiver, foiling until it's blowing 18 and then just switching to a fin. By far the worst with a fin in very light wind because it's narrower. You'd need the Tuttle head for the i84. By far the worst for learning the basics but if you really mean the basic-basics you shouldn't try to learn those on any of these boards - much better to rent/borrow an old stocker (the 200ltr yacht would be excellent) which won't ding up easily. Experience with lasers is great and wake foiling great too, but there's a two-week sail-handling learning period which is just much easier on something wide, floaty and ding-proof.

BTW - I've only been foiling for a year (windsurfing for 40) but for me the "all you need is a 4.0" is a myth. I use a 7.0 Flyer in 10-16 and shift down to a 5.8 in 15+. The lighter, younger guys who pump well can use the very small sails in almost nothing but it's not as easy for everyone as they make it look. What I'm saying is - get a 6.0 you like.

Grantmac
316 posts
11 Jun 2020 7:01AM
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If you are thinking you'll use a fin when it gets windy I'd would reconsider that. In practice I can foil in far more wind than I'd use a fin in few same size board.

MagicRide
496 posts
11 Jun 2020 7:10AM
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I would post this in the foiling section. You will get much more advice their. I've been foiling for 3 months and love it. But I can say, since you have the SS hover glide foil, I would match it with a SS board. The foot strap placement, swing weight and board volume distribution with match up with your SS foil. I'm reading the Wizard is the board of choice currently. Check out all the posts in foiling. I bet those posts will answer most of your questions. I believe you can sail the SS boards with fins as well. The i84 wing is amazing! I have that wing and use it all the time. I'm up on foil with a minimum of 10 mph of wind on my 130L SS Dialer board with my 6.8 sail. I'm 175 pounds, 5' 11".

phxdude
5 posts
11 Jun 2020 7:10PM
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Wow! Excellent advice guys! @Awalkspoiled - Thank you for the detailed rundown of those boards. Very helpful.

So, I decided that I would probably concentrate on foiling as that will get me going on the lake most of the time in the 10-15 range and I already have the foil(s). As Grantmac said, there isnt really a top end on them if you have the right wings. I still need to learn the windsurfing 101 stuff which a buddy of mine said he'd help me out with on his inflatable 200L+ SUP style board on a 3.x training sail. We'll see how that goes.

I also came to the same conclusion as MagicRide that paring the SS foil with a SS board is probably a good idea. I've been reading in the foiling section and found a guy that switched from the Lightwind to the Levitator and said he loves it so that swayed me a bit. I pulled the trigger on the Levitator 160/Flyer 7.0 setup to give this a go! It might not be the perfect all around setup, but I think it'll get me hooked and I can figure out what gear changes to make in the future if any. I'm also going to keep my eye out for a smaller sail also in case the 7 is a bit to aggressive initially...

Excited for the new adventure and learning curve! Cheers!

MagicRide
496 posts
12 Jun 2020 1:02AM
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Windsurfing in the air is super awesome! Traditional windsurfing is great when the wind comes up 18+, but this windfoiling rocks when the wind is light. I have almost trippled the amount of days on the water in just over 4 months into the season adding the foil board to the mix! Your sail sizing is so much smaller on foil. For example,

6.8 sail, Wind range 10-13 mph

6.0 sail, Wind range 12-15 mph

5.2 sail, Wind range 14-17 mph

phxdude
5 posts
18 Jun 2020 12:44PM
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Alright guys - Just got back from the first outing at the lake and it was a humbling experience!! Damn. I''m along ways off of my goal of foiling someday, thats ok though, have to enjoy the journey.

So, wind was 5-10 or so and inconsistent. Maybe the odd puff higher. Not the best really.

I started on my buddies inflatable 200L with a center fin and tail fin. The rig he chose was super small 3.0 kids rig just to get a feel for it. With this setup, I'm not sure if its because the sail was so small, but I/we found it impossible to do anything but drift downwind. Very little forward movement even on a reach position, just sideways drifting. Upwind was hopeless. All I/we could do is drift downwind sideways or actually go on a run which made the situation worse. Ended up getting dragged back by a jetski. The 3.0 was chosen because my buddy had a tough time with a bigger sail his first day a few weeks back, so he rigged this one up for today. My mast/boom/ext has not arrived yet in the mail.

Next session we moved the 3.0 sail rig to the 160 Levitator with just the 60cm mast attached, no foil. We both had better success on the Levi, but the wind was also slightly more consistent for this. I made a few out and backs on a reach and learned to rotate the board (on purpose ) but still couldn't make any headway upwind at all. There wasn't enough pressure in the sail to lean back on it at all and overall, the board never really accelerated much, just barely plowed in a forward-ish sideways course which ended up downwind slightly.

Is it advisable to go with a bigger sail to get some momentum or will I just drift downwind faster Recommendations to avoid drifting downwind to an unrecoverable position or goals for the next outing? Ideal beginner sail for a 95kg guy in ~10knots or so? I have access to 4.8 and a 7.0, but open to other options. Seems like I need a bigger sail to be able to lean back on and get moving.

Don't laugh!!

Cheers!

thedoor
389 posts
20 Jun 2020 1:44AM
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Select to expand quote
phxdude said..
Alright guys - Just got back from the first outing at the lake and it was a humbling experience!! Damn. I''m along ways off of my goal of foiling someday, thats ok though, have to enjoy the journey.

So, wind was 5-10 or so and inconsistent. Maybe the odd puff higher. Not the best really.

I started on my buddies inflatable 200L with a center fin and tail fin. The rig he chose was super small 3.0 kids rig just to get a feel for it. With this setup, I'm not sure if its because the sail was so small, but I/we found it impossible to do anything but drift downwind. Very little forward movement even on a reach position, just sideways drifting. Upwind was hopeless. All I/we could do is drift downwind sideways or actually go on a run which made the situation worse. Ended up getting dragged back by a jetski. The 3.0 was chosen because my buddy had a tough time with a bigger sail his first day a few weeks back, so he rigged this one up for today. My mast/boom/ext has not arrived yet in the mail.

Next session we moved the 3.0 sail rig to the 160 Levitator with just the 60cm mast attached, no foil. We both had better success on the Levi, but the wind was also slightly more consistent for this. I made a few out and backs on a reach and learned to rotate the board (on purpose ) but still couldn't make any headway upwind at all. There wasn't enough pressure in the sail to lean back on it at all and overall, the board never really accelerated much, just barely plowed in a forward-ish sideways course which ended up downwind slightly.

Is it advisable to go with a bigger sail to get some momentum or will I just drift downwind faster Recommendations to avoid drifting downwind to an unrecoverable position or goals for the next outing? Ideal beginner sail for a 95kg guy in ~10knots or so? I have access to 4.8 and a 7.0, but open to other options. Seems like I need a bigger sail to be able to lean back on and get moving.

Don't laugh!!

Cheers!


Everyone does the walk of shame when learning. Yes its time for more sail. 7m might be a bit big initially but after a few sessions with the 4.8 you might be able to manage the 7m in 10 knots

phxdude
5 posts
20 Jun 2020 12:24PM
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thedoor said..
Everyone does the walk of shame when learning. Yes its time for more sail. 7m might be a bit big initially but after a few sessions with the 4.8 you might be able to manage the 7m in 10 knots




Thanks for the reply! Honestly we're just on our own, the more guidance, reply's the better. No school/lessons/experienced anyone around so stabbing in the dark here with YouTube and internet knowledge.

So, the 4.8 states that it'll rig on a 430 mast (70% Carbon fiber RDM mast. Constant curve bend characteristics), but it didn't play nice in real life. Down-hauled to the max, the battens were extending under the mast by about an inch and it had a nasty wrinkle by the length of the mast. Pretty sure that isn't the right outcome. I don't think more down-haul/flex would solve it. Will probably not give this one a go unless my buddy can get it rigged on his stuff better.

I also rigged up the 7.0 and everything went smoothly and I feel confident that this setup is lake-worthy even though I may not be ready for it.



JonnyWindsurf
WA, 26 posts
21 Jun 2020 2:43AM
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I have the 7.0 Flyer as well. Did you buy the mast that Sailworks suggested to get for it? I

phxdude
5 posts
21 Jun 2020 5:15AM
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JonnyWindsurf said..
I have the 7.0 Flyer as well. Did you buy the mast that Sailworks suggested to get for it? I


Hi, I did not as they recommend a 90+carbon mast I believe. I have a 70% and the Flyer rigs up fine...its the other 4.8 that was a bit wonky.

thedoor
389 posts
22 Jun 2020 4:07AM
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phxdude said..

JonnyWindsurf said..
I have the 7.0 Flyer as well. Did you buy the mast that Sailworks suggested to get for it? I



Hi, I did not as they recommend a 90+carbon mast I believe. I have a 70% and the Flyer rigs up fine...its the other 4.8 that was a bit wonky.


You sure you cannot get more downhaul on the 4.8? The mast is straight.



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"Newb - Crossover Board selection WS/Foiling" started by phxdude