Forums > Stand Up Paddle General

Surfer's hatred of Sups; views?

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Created by Bowerboy > 9 months ago, 27 Mar 2017
Smash1
NSW, 824 posts
28 Mar 2017 3:18PM
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MickPC said..
I think SUP's are a good board to have in the quiver for when its tiny or flat. So you can still get out & have a bit of fun on the water. I ride short boards & longboards about equally & dust off the SUP in summer to ride some ankle to knee high waves. For me they're a good board to have in your quiver.....however I do not think they are a good board in bigger waves & yes they are very dangerous in crowded conditions no matter how good you think you are. Surfing background or not.

If I get out on the SUP & there are a few people out I tend to end up surf coaching & wave spotting. Then grabbing left over waves or wide ones everyone is going to be too deep for. But there is usually no one else out on account of it being flat in everyone elses eyes.

I don't understand young people or people without some kind of injury preventing them from riding surf craft offering much greater performance opting to ride SUP's in all conditions. Dedicating themselves to this one board type. They might have a greater wave count, but sacrifice performance...the best thing about riding a SUP is how good a surfboard of longboard feels when you get off it.

Why the animosity towards SUP's a lot of people see it as cheating. SUP's can spot waves much sooner, get into a position of priority sooner & gain momentum earlier. Far too many take advantage of this & it sux seeing a SUP simply trimming across one of the waves of the day. I do have a lot of friends who ride SUP's & a lot of them are pretty good about not hogging waves. Things were pretty bad 5 or 6 years ago when the infestation began. But it does seem to have chilled at my local. Most of the SUP's will go & surf a certain section of reef. Longboarders on another & shortboarders on another. And if SUP's do come over to one of the other spots, if they exercise some etiquette there's no problems. You don't need to catch sets on a SUP, you can have a great time going for waves no one else would have otherwise caught. The best SUP rider I know does this, he catches wave after wave after wave. But no one gives a fark, coz they were waves no one else was gonna catch. He will often even stop paddling for a wave when he see's another person is likely to catch it.

I imagine Manly is very very different to my local being smack bang in the city. But if you utilize the strengths of the SUP, like their ability to ride small waves or waves with sectioning fat sections other boards won't glide through you can have heaps of fun...also if your able. Why not add another board to your quiver which is not a SUP to use on days suited to other surf craft. SUP's suck in wind unless your downwinding & there is usually a lot less crowd. They're also pretty hard to get out the back in bigger days with no channel or a point to paddle wide. The learning curve is a bit steeper, but well worth it



Hmmmm......can I suggest that you grab something along the lines of a Sunova Acid or one of the many other much smaller and seriously challenging high performance boards, where the majority of the board is under water and has absolutely no glide at all and therefore no advantage over prone board riders and then see how you go before assuming that all SUPers simply ride the larger mal style SUPs that can sit way out the back and catch every wave that comes their way. A huge amount of this thread appears to relate to the riders of the larger longer SUPs.

Smash1
NSW, 824 posts
28 Mar 2017 3:28PM
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TimKay said..
Personally I don't think it's a SUP thing at all.
Surfers are generally having a crack at SUP riders because they are probably having a bad surf due to the line up being so fricken crowded
You talk about Manly, surfing and the weekend.
That in itself is a recipe for disaster.
Only the entire stretch your probably lucky to have 2m of water to yourself.
People with all levels of ability with every right to be out there like the next person. Everyone is out there. Bower talks about the new generation of self entitled new locals in their multi million dollar homes that's better than the previous and your adding that attitude to the line up.
Not to mention the surf school, Multiple backpackers. Board hire shops. The influx of Westys on the weekend.
You ask everyone why they surf and it's always "it's fun"
But I hate to break it to you. Surfing on the weekend on the Northern Beaches of Sydney is a F..... up
No fun at all.



I agree with TK..... please please please do not come to Manly to surf or SUP especially on the weekend :-) Us "Mosmanites" are taking over - our houses are worth so much more than those Bower Boys......;-))))))

Legion
WA, 2222 posts
28 Mar 2017 12:57PM
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One point that's been mentioned a few times - please don't act as a spotter. Most of the more experienced surfing crew have spent years perfecting the art of reading the water and it gives an advantage in a crowded lineup. If someone's calling approaching waves it suddenly levels out the field and that advantage is lost. It's also super condescending. I'm sure beginners appreciate it though.

Bara
WA, 647 posts
28 Mar 2017 1:15PM
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Interesting read fellas. As a shortboarder that has been run over by a SUP its good to get the insight into just how you lot are thinking. No he wasnt a kook he just dropped into a bomb while i was paddling out and never looked and couldnt turn fast enough once he saw me. Lucky to still be here.

Just like every other surf craft rider there are knobs like smash that just dont get it and watermen like holden who have it nailed.

Yes theres probably some prejudice from the other surfers but its a case of if in doubt err on the side of caution with sups as in the hands of a kook or even a pretty experienced rider in big surf they are damn dangerous to be around. But I reckon if your being yelled at then ill bet just like any other surfer its because you've done something to upset the apple cart

MickPC
8266 posts
28 Mar 2017 2:13PM
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Legion said..


One point that's been mentioned a few times - please don't act as a spotter. Most of the more experienced surfing crew have spent years perfecting the art of reading the water and it gives an advantage in a crowded lineup. If someone's calling approaching waves it suddenly levels out the field and that advantage is lost. It's also super condescending. I'm sure beginners appreciate it though.


lol that is funny coz I said this just this morning to a mate about a chick that used to do it. I'm sitting there on my shortie & see this approaching wave & I'm acting all non chalont ready to spring into action at the last second. When I hear a "woohoo, out the back" from a certain female friend sitting on the shoulder on her SUP. Used to really annoy me, but she spends more time on her longboard these days so its no longer a problem.

Like I said, if I'm out there on a SUP its tiny & the other people out there will generally be people who get out there when its tiny surfing some kinda high volume mini mal kinda thing. I wouldn't help other people, they will be getting plenty already.

But I can relate mate

MickPC
8266 posts
28 Mar 2017 2:24PM
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Smash1 said..

MickPC said..
I think SUP's are a good board to have in the quiver for when its tiny or flat. So you can still get out & have a bit of fun on the water. I ride short boards & longboards about equally & dust off the SUP in summer to ride some ankle to knee high waves. For me they're a good board to have in your quiver.....however I do not think they are a good board in bigger waves & yes they are very dangerous in crowded conditions no matter how good you think you are. Surfing background or not.

If I get out on the SUP & there are a few people out I tend to end up surf coaching & wave spotting. Then grabbing left over waves or wide ones everyone is going to be too deep for. But there is usually no one else out on account of it being flat in everyone elses eyes.

I don't understand young people or people without some kind of injury preventing them from riding surf craft offering much greater performance opting to ride SUP's in all conditions. Dedicating themselves to this one board type. They might have a greater wave count, but sacrifice performance...the best thing about riding a SUP is how good a surfboard of longboard feels when you get off it.

Why the animosity towards SUP's a lot of people see it as cheating. SUP's can spot waves much sooner, get into a position of priority sooner & gain momentum earlier. Far too many take advantage of this & it sux seeing a SUP simply trimming across one of the waves of the day. I do have a lot of friends who ride SUP's & a lot of them are pretty good about not hogging waves. Things were pretty bad 5 or 6 years ago when the infestation began. But it does seem to have chilled at my local. Most of the SUP's will go & surf a certain section of reef. Longboarders on another & shortboarders on another. And if SUP's do come over to one of the other spots, if they exercise some etiquette there's no problems. You don't need to catch sets on a SUP, you can have a great time going for waves no one else would have otherwise caught. The best SUP rider I know does this, he catches wave after wave after wave. But no one gives a fark, coz they were waves no one else was gonna catch. He will often even stop paddling for a wave when he see's another person is likely to catch it.

I imagine Manly is very very different to my local being smack bang in the city. But if you utilize the strengths of the SUP, like their ability to ride small waves or waves with sectioning fat sections other boards won't glide through you can have heaps of fun...also if your able. Why not add another board to your quiver which is not a SUP to use on days suited to other surf craft. SUP's suck in wind unless your downwinding & there is usually a lot less crowd. They're also pretty hard to get out the back in bigger days with no channel or a point to paddle wide. The learning curve is a bit steeper, but well worth it




Hmmmm......can I suggest that you grab something along the lines of a Sunova Acid or one of the many other much smaller and seriously challenging high performance boards, where the majority of the board is under water and has absolutely no glide at all and therefore no advantage over prone board riders and then see how you go before assuming that all SUPers simply ride the larger mal style SUPs that can sit way out the back and catch every wave that comes their way. A huge amount of this thread appears to relate to the riders of the larger longer SUPs.


First SUP I had was a big Sunova. Second was an 8'5 Starboard Pro that I could surf given the right waves but I thought this is just stupid. It negated the benefits of having a SUP in the first place & I'd much prefer to be on a more refined board given the kinda condtions a lower volumed SUP required. So I now have an 8'10 widepoint I can take out in small swell summer onshores with no one out.

But anyway, yes you are right. Most of the thread is in regard to the big boaty SUP's coz most of them are big boaty SUP's. I see guys on the lower volumed vanguard type of shape Sunova struggling to catch a wave & then not planing very well when they get one. Probably more suited to sucky beachies, but again. If you can ride one of these, surely you can ride other surf craft & enjoy the benefits they bring.

LateStarter
WA, 589 posts
28 Mar 2017 4:22PM
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Bowerboy said..
... so I headed off to find a safe spot. On my way another surfer reached out and gave my board a shove causing me to fall off.


If you're close enough to another surfer for him to just reach out and push you off your board you're clearly in the wrong.

There's no hope for you I'm afraid. Jump on Gumtree, sell your SUP and maybe pick up a nice set of golf clubs or a carbon road bike with some lycra.

SUPSMURF
NSW, 164 posts
28 Mar 2017 8:21PM
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Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. So someone is saying that I should ride a shorty because it will be better suited to a certain wave type or crowd. What a croc, that is like saying that you should buy a SUP and ditch your shorty for the same reason. I rode a shorty for 35 years before switching to a SUP 4 years ago and then I had an epiphany, I actually prefer riding a short SUP. What a revelation. I say ride what gives you stoke but as always give respect to receive it and know the correct etiquette no matter the craft.

maxeaus
NSW, 326 posts
28 Mar 2017 8:34PM
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Just tell Wazza that you just ordered one of these, tell him he's very privileged as he's gunna be the first to see it!...... Let me know Wazza's thoughts on it.

bobajob
QLD, 1533 posts
28 Mar 2017 7:47PM
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LateStarter said..

Bowerboy said..
... so I headed off to find a safe spot. On my way another surfer reached out and gave my board a shove causing me to fall off.



If you're close enough to another surfer for him to just reach out and push you off your board you're clearly in the wrong.

There's no hope for you I'm afraid. Jump on Gumtree, sell your SUP and maybe pick up a nice set of golf clubs or a carbon road bike with some lycra.


Or you could buy a mal, which makes it acceptable to take whatever waves you like.

Chris_M
2128 posts
28 Mar 2017 6:35PM
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Sounds like you all overthink it.
Yeah I be respectful and wait my turn and call surfers in and that, but I also go hard and charge as bigger waves as I can get my hands on.

Nearly every surf I have friendly chats with the surfers who usually tell me I'm shredding it.

The worst surfs I have are when I think Im pissing everybody off and get all unsure of myself... then I head down the beach for a wee bank of my own.

That story about Omaha sounds hilarious, a pack of angry city folk playing hardcore surfer dudes in Daddys million dollar termite infested vacation house. What a crap wave compared to all the goodness to be found in other East Coast spots nearby!

MickPC
8266 posts
28 Mar 2017 6:35PM
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supgman said..
Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. So someone is saying that I should ride a shorty because it will be better suited to a certain wave type or crowd. What a croc, that is like saying that you should buy a SUP and ditch your shorty for the same reason. I rode a shorty for 35 years before switching to a SUP 4 years ago and then I had an epiphany, I actually prefer riding a short SUP. What a revelation. I say ride what gives you stoke but as always give respect to receive it and know the correct etiquette no matter the craft.


I've been riding shorties 38 years, longboards 3 years & SUP's 2 years...yes people are saying certain surf craft are suited to certain waves. Elevated crowd numbers in larger waves is absolutely a defining factor in surf craft choice if it poses a danger to others.

Otherwise I agree, get out have fun without abusing your advantages...but still don't understand why you would ditch shortboards or longboards in favour of a SUP unless you are physically disabled in some way. The added volume to stand & paddle is detrimental to performance as soon as you start riding a wave. It is the aspects prior to catching a wave that are beneficial to SUP riding.

MarkW81
VIC, 85 posts
28 Mar 2017 9:43PM
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E T said..
oh dear me, the age old, "why do they hate us".

This is not new my lads. Surfers hate:-
- Ski riders.
- Belly boarders.
- SUP's
- Kneelos
- Clubbies.
and anyone else that is different to them.
Nothing new here at all. But what a lot, yes a lot, of SUPsurfers don't realise is that they may not have any prior surfing skills.
From observation many later day SUPsurfers have come from flat-water paddling to SUPsurfing.

There are a whole lot of skills that are needed to SUPsurf, not just paddling for a wave and riding it. the etiquette needs to be learned, the skills need to be learned and mostly you need to turn your brain on.
I have seen too many SUPsurfers paddle out and hog the waves. no wonder the surfers get pissed off. This is not to say that there are not a lot of arsewipe surfers out there who are wankers, there are heaps. But there are also a lot of dickhead SUPsurfers too.

Best to play by the rules. Remember that SUP's are big and heavy and often hard to control. Maybe think about how many people are in the water on any break, how close are you to other prone surfers, how many waves are you getting etc. etc. etc.

It's about sharing, even if the bad boys wont share, its about being safe even if others aren't, surfing is not something you walk into one day because you just brought a SUP.
Pay the dues, learn the skills, earn your place. Piss off out of the surf to flat-water if you are dangerous.

Turn your brain on if you enter the surf.

now before you label me:-
- Surfed for 38 years.
- SUP'd for nearly ten years in all categories.
- Respect all people in and out of the water.

Have fun, respect others and enjoy the waves.

ET.


Totally agree ET. There are dick heads on all watercraft.
I think surfers hate everyone else as everyone else has an advantage over them when paddling for waves.
My mate was on a clubby board and copped abuse because he was catching all the waves the surfers couldn't but also because he was different.
I just stay away from the crowds and pitty the poor surfers battling with 50 other blokes for the "best" waves. And hope they never figure out what they are missing out on.

Cobra
9106 posts
28 Mar 2017 7:01PM
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Legion said..


One point that's been mentioned a few times - please don't act as a spotter. Most of the more experienced surfing crew have spent years perfecting the art of reading the water and it gives an advantage in a crowded lineup. If someone's calling approaching waves it suddenly levels out the field and that advantage is lost. It's also super condescending. I'm sure beginners appreciate it though.


Legion do you own a sup?

Souwester
WA, 1255 posts
28 Mar 2017 9:19PM
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Well this thread went down the path most travelled ha ha

boundeast
124 posts
28 Mar 2017 9:21PM
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LateStarter said..
In 20-odd years of surfing, I don't think I've ever seen anyone get yelled at by mistake, regardless of the craft they ride.

This topic is discussed on here every couple of weeks in one way or another.

The message is always the same. Learn the rules, pay your dues, don't be a dick.



I have been a respectful surfer for 40 years (LB, shortboard, kneeboard, and yes, sponge even), last 4 on a sup. I know well, and always play by, the rules. I surf the less crowded peaks, etc. But I've had run-ins since switching to sup, that i would have never had on an LB or a shtbd--and not one run-in was prompted by bad behavior on my part--just grumpy dbags. I ignore them, and if they persist i tell them to eff off. I understand that some day i may get a beatdown, but i know bullies, and usually they back off if you stand up to them--they go on to easier targets. Make yourself an easy target and they will focus on you.

Some day i may get a good beating but so be it. NYC-life growing up left me no fear of fighting, but at 58 i'd rather not get broken up in a fight. Hasnt happened yet. I am usually the only sup where i surf and have many proner friends after the years ive been around--who might even back me up if it got really ugly.....

So my experience is quite the opposite of yours. I think the yellers arent making any mistakes--i think they dont care about sup behavior, they just want to bitch around about something, and why not go after that sup guy having fun in the lineup. No mistake--just an ahole being an ahole.

SUPSMURF
NSW, 164 posts
29 Mar 2017 7:08AM
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Well said boundeast.

SUPSMURF
NSW, 164 posts
29 Mar 2017 7:12AM
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Mickpc - I respect your opinion. I ride a small SUP in all conditions and I have no physical disabilities but that doesn't make me right or you. I just prefer a different challenge. Each to there own I guess. Gav

chrispy
WA, 9675 posts
29 Mar 2017 4:29AM
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Bowerboy said..
I wonder what is going to happen when people start foiling at some of these breaks!


a farkwit on a foil nearly took my mate out at the alley last swell we had . im sure somebody knows that arrogant ****

another 10 ft and my mate would be in half...thats what happens...

micksmith
VIC, 1674 posts
29 Mar 2017 7:49AM
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MickPC said..

supgman said..
Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. So someone is saying that I should ride a shorty because it will be better suited to a certain wave type or crowd. What a croc, that is like saying that you should buy a SUP and ditch your shorty for the same reason. I rode a shorty for 35 years before switching to a SUP 4 years ago and then I had an epiphany, I actually prefer riding a short SUP. What a revelation. I say ride what gives you stoke but as always give respect to receive it and know the correct etiquette no matter the craft.




but still don't understand why you would ditch shortboards or longboards in favour of a SUP unless you are physically disabled in some way. The added volume to stand & paddle is detrimental to performance as soon as you start riding a wave. It is the aspects prior to catching a wave that are beneficial to SUP riding.


How ridiculous, so a longboard performs as a short board, I don't think so.

Macaha
QLD, 21869 posts
29 Mar 2017 7:24AM
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I've read so much about sup's being for old or people with back injuries?

and those foil boards are about to get banned.

Macaha
QLD, 21869 posts
29 Mar 2017 7:27AM
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micksmith said..

MickPC said..


supgman said..
Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. So someone is saying that I should ride a shorty because it will be better suited to a certain wave type or crowd. What a croc, that is like saying that you should buy a SUP and ditch your shorty for the same reason. I rode a shorty for 35 years before switching to a SUP 4 years ago and then I had an epiphany, I actually prefer riding a short SUP. What a revelation. I say ride what gives you stoke but as always give respect to receive it and know the correct etiquette no matter the craft.





but still don't understand why you would ditch shortboards or longboards in favour of a SUP unless you are physically disabled in some way. The added volume to stand & paddle is detrimental to performance as soon as you start riding a wave. It is the aspects prior to catching a wave that are beneficial to SUP riding.



How ridiculous, so a longboard performs as a short board, I don't think so.


MickPC but you cant do those ridiculous dish pan turns on a shortboard or longboard.

Bowerboy
NSW, 141 posts
29 Mar 2017 8:48AM
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LateStarter said..

Bowerboy said..
... so I headed off to find a safe spot. On my way another surfer reached out and gave my board a shove causing me to fall off.



If you're close enough to another surfer for him to just reach out and push you off your board you're clearly in the wrong.

There's no hope for you I'm afraid. Jump on Gumtree, sell your SUP and maybe pick up a nice set of golf clubs or a carbon road bike with some lycra.


No chance!

Cobra
9106 posts
29 Mar 2017 6:11AM
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This what happens when you go to the dark side, Darth vader had the same problem.
what you need is a 26 foot deathstar.
Hope this helps.

micksmith
VIC, 1674 posts
29 Mar 2017 9:28AM
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Macaha said..

micksmith said..


MickPC said..



supgman said..
Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. So someone is saying that I should ride a shorty because it will be better suited to a certain wave type or crowd. What a croc, that is like saying that you should buy a SUP and ditch your shorty for the same reason. I rode a shorty for 35 years before switching to a SUP 4 years ago and then I had an epiphany, I actually prefer riding a short SUP. What a revelation. I say ride what gives you stoke but as always give respect to receive it and know the correct etiquette no matter the craft.






but still don't understand why you would ditch shortboards or longboards in favour of a SUP unless you are physically disabled in some way. The added volume to stand & paddle is detrimental to performance as soon as you start riding a wave. It is the aspects prior to catching a wave that are beneficial to SUP riding.




How ridiculous, so a longboard performs as a short board, I don't think so.



MickPC but you cant do those ridiculous dish pan turns on a shortboard or longboard.


Just not trying hard enough

MickPC
8266 posts
29 Mar 2017 7:03AM
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supgman said..
Mickpc - I respect your opinion. I ride a small SUP in all conditions and I have no physical disabilities but that doesn't make me right or you. I just prefer a different challenge. Each to there own I guess. Gav


As I yours mate, np...just saying if people are not limited to riding a SUP coz of an injury I believe they are better off having more variety in their quiver to suit the conditions of the day. But then again its better for me in the long run if they don't

Richoa
NSW, 478 posts
29 Mar 2017 11:24AM
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I haven't surfed for a long time and don't SUP either. But I do remember the surf ski guys mostly out of control and taking way too many waves with a distinct advantage they had to straight line a beautiful wave.

It seems to me sitting outside looking in, sups, mals, kitesurfers and wave ski's can access many breaks that a prone surfer cant.
and track with much more speed to allow them to make sections they cant. Probably upsetting to a few but I think that should be your focus area for such vessels.

On crowded days leave the main break to the young guns, we had our time!


Ashmullet
NSW, 282 posts
29 Mar 2017 11:45AM
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theres al out of guys on sups who's action leave a lot to be desired also much like many a short board rider foils will be the next thing for them to whine about

Macaha
QLD, 21869 posts
29 Mar 2017 10:48AM
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micksmith said..

Macaha said..


micksmith said..



MickPC said..




supgman said..
Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. So someone is saying that I should ride a shorty because it will be better suited to a certain wave type or crowd. What a croc, that is like saying that you should buy a SUP and ditch your shorty for the same reason. I rode a shorty for 35 years before switching to a SUP 4 years ago and then I had an epiphany, I actually prefer riding a short SUP. What a revelation. I say ride what gives you stoke but as always give respect to receive it and know the correct etiquette no matter the craft.







but still don't understand why you would ditch shortboards or longboards in favour of a SUP unless you are physically disabled in some way. The added volume to stand & paddle is detrimental to performance as soon as you start riding a wave. It is the aspects prior to catching a wave that are beneficial to SUP riding.





How ridiculous, so a longboard performs as a short board, I don't think so.




MickPC but you cant do those ridiculous dish pan turns on a shortboard or longboard.



Just not trying hard enough


No mate,it didn't take much to bait you

HumanCartoon
VIC, 2098 posts
29 Mar 2017 11:50AM
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chrispy said..
a farkwit on a foil nearly took my mate out at the alley...another 10 ft and my mate would be in half...thats what happens...





so he passed by your mate by a clear board length or more?



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"Surfer's hatred of Sups; views?" started by Bowerboy