Accident

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Freeflow
Freeflow
QLD
133 posts
QLD, 133 posts
7 Dec 2008 6:34pm
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=683378
Freeflow
Freeflow
QLD
133 posts
QLD, 133 posts
7 Dec 2008 6:37pm
Just spotted someone's already posted about it.
echostorm
echostorm
QLD
1245 posts
QLD, 1245 posts
7 Dec 2008 8:37pm
I cannot stress the importance of knowing your safety systems. I am not going to speculate on this poor blokes accident, but I am saying how important it is to know where your safety release is.

As an example, two weeks ago we had a solid 25 knots blowing. I was on an 11m and as I landed a gust hit the kite, sending it into a death spiral. I was standing in front of rocks and in less then a second I hit my release sending the kite down the beach. A mate with me couldnt believe the speed I pulled it. This release is your lifeline. If I was half a second slower I would have been dragged along the rocks and then not physically able to pull on it.


YOUR KITE IS NOT AS IMPORTANT AS YOUR LIFE.

As SOON as you see things going bad, dont hesitate, just throw the release.

This needs to be a reflex. To make something a reflex it needs to be repeated hundreds of times. PRACTICE RELEASING YOUR KITE EVERYTIME YOU GO OUT.

Be safe.
Kate Russell
Kate Russell
QLD
14 posts
QLD, 14 posts
8 Dec 2008 2:14pm
My thoughts to the man and his family. I trust that he comes out OK.
loco4olas
loco4olas
NSW
1525 posts
NSW, 1525 posts
8 Dec 2008 4:18pm
That's heavy-the southerly came through pretty hard-sh$t happens-and soooo fast when it does.

Despite being an atheist-god's speed with recovery for the bloke.
puppetonastring
puppetonastring
WA
3619 posts
WA, 3619 posts
8 Dec 2008 2:39pm
echostorm said...

I cannot stress the importance of knowing your safety systems. This needs to be a reflex. To make something a reflex it needs to be repeated hundreds of times. PRACTICE RELEASING YOUR KITE EVERYTIME YOU GO OUT.


Good advice echostorm but who is ever going to do that ??
Answer - Anyone using a Slingy SUREFIRE Spreader Bar.
It gives you simple release and reload and its right there in the same spot, same action everytime you need it.
AND you get to practice your QR everytime you land your kite.
For less than $200 IMO they should be compulsory - and no they dont release when you dont want them to. Ive had mine for 3 years and Ive accidently hit it twice. And one of those times I was quite glad I did

Seriously - every kiter should look at this option as an essential part of any kit - especially any start-up kit. Its the one bit of gear that really could save your life - and you get to keep your kite as well !!! If your instructor doesnt reckon they are worth it ignore him/her and look for yourself - its a no-brainer.
ade r
ade r
NSW
102 posts
NSW, 102 posts
8 Dec 2008 6:57pm
testing safety release: how about pulling the safety just before launching. hook up, pull the safety, connect it back together, hook up, launch.

i do this everytime, to make sure it works.
Bigwavedave
Bigwavedave
QLD
2057 posts
QLD, 2057 posts
8 Dec 2008 6:47pm
Heal well brother!

Keep the passion!
Uber
Uber
NSW
482 posts
NSW, 482 posts
9 Dec 2008 12:35am
Puppet I agree Slingly Surefire spreader has saved me many a time. Once dragged on the beach when my kite was looping after a bad launch cause one of my lines got caught and i still managed to release. Great simple system. I dont ride slingy kites but the surefire is an absolute must for safety.

You dont have to think about pulling or pushing up or down, left or right.(depending on your chicken loop safety system)

I always have my thumb on it when I launch or land just in case.
Saffer
Saffer
VIC
4501 posts
VIC, 4501 posts
9 Dec 2008 8:01am
Not sure if the spreaderbar is going to help much. When it comes to loftings, you'll be 10m up before you even think about pulling your safety. I know this because I've been in a lofting before when a squall came through. I got lofted over water, I was a fair distance up before I pulled mine, it happens that fast - I was over water so I could. Girl with me wasn't so lucky, she spent a month in a coma after she got lofted on land.
Mr float
Mr float
NSW
3452 posts
NSW, 3452 posts
9 Dec 2008 8:15am
Saffer said...

Not sure if the spreaderbar is going to help much. When it comes to loftings, you'll be 10m up before you even think about pulling your safety. I know this because I've been in a lofting before when a squall came through. I got lofted over water, I was a fair distance up before I pulled mine, it happens that fast - I was over water so I could. Girl with me wasn't so lucky, she spent a month in a coma after she got lofted on land.


Well said .I wouldn't have a clue what happened to the guy but in the context of the conversation and this reply it is important that people remember that they should be careful of any situation they put themselves in .it should never be assumed that lines won't break,kite doesn't depower and that release systems (I presonally prefer no to call it the popularly named 'safety" there is nothing safe about launching or flying close to downwind obstacles thinking that you are OK because you have a 'release system") fail or can't be reached for whatever reason
tobes
tobes
NSW
1000 posts
NSW, 1000 posts
9 Dec 2008 8:56am
It's made the paper again today.
The headline "Kite surfer peels off half his face"
www.smh.com.au/national/kitesurfer-peels-off-half-his-face-20081209-gdt5wn.html?page=2
The report says he is in a stable condition.
Sounds like the clubbies did a good job.
The article also quotes a Mr Rob Smallgood from AKSA, with some excellent safety advice.
I wonder if he knows Rob Smallwood?




loco4olas
loco4olas
NSW
1525 posts
NSW, 1525 posts
9 Dec 2008 10:35am
tobes said...

It's made the paper again today.
The headline "Kite surfer peels off half his face"
www.smh.com.au/national/kitesurfer-peels-off-half-his-face-20081209-gdt5wn.html?page=2
The report says he is in a stable condition.
Sounds like the clubbies did a good job.
The article also quotes a Mr Rob Smallgood from AKSA, with some excellent safety advice.
I wonder if he knows Rob Smallwood?


Smallwood/Smallgood-you get the picture right?
FreeFerty
FreeFerty
NSW
169 posts
NSW, 169 posts
9 Dec 2008 10:42am
If its in the paper you can rely on it being incorrect/twisted. Notice how the article ends with a massive quote regarding a previous accident (years old)lifted from the AKSA webpage totally not related. Good for getting the column inches up though. Media are scum.
vertigo
vertigo
NSW
34 posts
NSW, 34 posts
9 Dec 2008 10:43am
loco4olas said...



Smallwood/Smallgood-you get the picture right?


ROFL, did you type that with a pinky waving in the air???
KIT33R
KIT33R
NSW
1716 posts
NSW, 1716 posts
9 Dec 2008 3:02pm
I work in the hospital where the guy who had this unfortunate accident is hold up. I spoke to his mom who said he is going into surgery today. I passed on the best wishes from the kiting community.
seanor
seanor
VIC
8 posts
VIC, 8 posts
11 Dec 2008 11:54pm
Given the revolution in 2006 of kites with full depower upon bar release, I am always surprised that we don't hear any detail about what kind of kite the rider was using in any of the kite accidents reported. There is no doubt that the traditional C-kites, pre-2006, are 100 times more dangerous than the newer model bow or SLE kites. I am not suggesting that the newer de-power kites are foolproof and not dangerous (people still get in trouble with these as well), but I believe it is important to point out the differences in risk between older and newer kites - especially because many kiters new to the sport are getting into it by buying very cheap used C-kites. Personally, I think the kiteboarding community could take some responsibility for educating people new to the sport about the differences between older style C-Kites and newer de-power kites, encourage beginners to put out a little extra cash to get a kite with bar-release de-power, and actively discourage the sale of used C-kites, particularly to beginners.

On this note, I have talked to several beginners who have just completed lessons and their instructors did not have anything to say about them buying cheap used C-kites as a first option. Furthermore, with de-power kites for learners, I have witnessed first-hand how some instructors fail to have their students practicing just letting go of the bar when the kite powers up so they build the reflex...

First reflex with a de-power kite should be - "when in doubt, let it out" - and then plenty of practice with using the release systems...
Munter
Munter
NSW
210 posts
NSW, 210 posts
12 Dec 2008 2:32pm
I generally agree. Some kiters get their knickers in a knot about bow kites not being 100% safe but I think they represent a good step forward in terms of reducing the number of accidents.

Does anyone know what type of kite this guy was on? C or bow, not interested in branding.
bennie
bennie
ACT
1258 posts
ACT, 1258 posts
12 Dec 2008 5:19pm
aparently he was riding a 2008 9m bow,I wont mention the the brand, but I ride a similar kite and they are in my opinion very safe, let the bar go and lose 90% of its power.

I hope this guy pulls through without any lasting damage, but from what I've heard from some of my mates in the area is that this guy was an accident waiting to happen. Apparently he has been kiting for only 6 months, and has had to be rescued at least twice in that location, when I have never heard of anybody else needing rescuing there in several years. He has been seen setting up in unsafe areas, in unsafe conditions, where any sensible person would never kite. And ontop of that one of my mates reckons that only a month or so ago the kiter in question unbeleiveably asked him "what do these things do" refering to his depower straps.

It makes me mad that one idiots actions could jeopardise a sweet location. My local spot. Councils scare easy, and this has made it to the national press.
stabber
stabber
NSW
1114 posts
NSW, 1114 posts
14 Dec 2008 11:44am
someone said(to me yesterday) this poor fella didn't make it....is that true?
stabber
stabber
NSW
1114 posts
NSW, 1114 posts
14 Dec 2008 11:45am
some one said this fella didn't make it...is this true?
Kitehard
Kitehard
WA
2782 posts
WA, 2782 posts
14 Dec 2008 11:14am
Hey guys,

A wake up call to ALL users of ALL kites. The 90-100% depower claims by manufacturers are all well and good providing nothing extraordinary goes wrong. I have seen more people haplessly dragged for long distances by out of control Hybrids, Bows and SLE's than "C" kites.

In my experience, with the longer throw of the bars on SLE and BOW kites, it tends to increase the possibility of a back line tangling around a bar end and putting the kite into the usual deathloops. This was a much rarer scenario in the days of "C" kites.

"C" kites used to give you a quick drag until they got to neutral then they stopped unless massively overpowered. All these newer kites are definately easier to use and learn on and a bit safer in terms of lofting incidents should the wind violently pick up, but they are more prone to tangles resulting in bad draggings from crashes in the water, self launches, inversion, snapping bridles, self landing, water relaunches and so on.

People also tend to ride Bow, Hybrid and SLE kites way more overpowered than people ever did on "C" kites. This tends to put you into situations you wouldn't normally find yourself in. The kites do still have useable wind which are about 5 knots better than a "C" kite, riding them outside these ranges exposes you to hazards.

You'd have to be an idiot to rely soley on a kites claimed "100% depower". You need a proper flagging safety line and a quality easy to use quick release. The safety system should be checked regularly for function and you should be prepared to use it BEFORE things get out of hand.

If you are a rider that back loops the one way and twists your lines a lot around the centre lines , you need to untwist your lines by either spinning the opposite way or manually untwisting them. Twisted lines can result in a fouled and tangled release of the flagging system in an emergency, which will result in a bar you can no longer reach and a kite in the throws of death loops.

Never think it can't happen to you, kitesurfing is an extreme sport when it goes wrong, complacency can lead to death or serious injury.

Be Wary, it CAN happen to you to, even when you are good.

Good winds,



brode93
brode93
NSW
82 posts
NSW, 82 posts
14 Dec 2008 2:31pm
Talking to his mate at squids today he is alive but very sore ,slow recovery.All the best mate,also heard he has 6 kids [/s]from 6months to 11years old and was self employed not a good Xmas.
Kalavas
Kalavas
WA
146 posts
WA, 146 posts
14 Dec 2008 12:50pm
I think Kitehard makes an excellent point. I saw a few near serious accidently yesterday, all of which I believe were on nice shiny, new "safe" 2009 model kites.

Safety systems are all good and well, but if you A) haven't drilled it a hundred times so you use it in an emergency without thinking about it and B) think you are invincible as a result of their presence, you're probably less safe with a newer safer kite.

The biggest safety risk is probably not rogue gusts or CUB's on jetski's, it's the illusion of safety that a lot of people are kiting under...
Mr float
Mr float
NSW
3452 posts
NSW, 3452 posts
14 Dec 2008 4:28pm
Kalavas said...

I think Kitehard makes an excellent point. I saw a few near serious accidently yesterday, all of which I believe were on nice shiny, new "safe" 2009 model kites.

Safety systems are all good and well, but if you A) haven't drilled it a hundred times so you use it in an emergency without thinking about it and B) think you are invincible as a result of their presence, you're probably less safe with a newer safer kite.

The biggest safety risk is probably not rogue gusts or CUB's on jetski's, it's the illusion of safety that a lot of people are kiting under...


at last the meassge seems to be getting through
kiter789
kiter789
NSW
238 posts
NSW, 238 posts
14 Dec 2008 8:09pm
Kiteboarding; Ride like it's still dangerous.

Seriously - depower my arse. It's one of the most irresponsible cons put about by the kiteboarding industry in recent years. A kite has enough traction to pull you along, and off the water. By its very nature, this means it can give you a spanking. In the old days, the kites were so twitchy, and the spankings so frequent, that people rode scared. They thought long and hard about when and where to go. Nowadays people think; Oh it's ok, I've got 100% depower!

I think people are far less conscious of how nasty kiting can be. It was safer when it was dangerous.

So: ride like it's still dangerous.

Andrash
Andrash
WA
637 posts
WA, 637 posts
14 Dec 2008 6:29pm
..yes, full depower is sweet, but it does not teach respect....until something goes wrong of course...and than it becomes ugly......
...I would still think, though, that proportionate to the number of kiters at the present, there are less serious or fatal accidents now, then for example 5 years ago....and that is due to safer QR and depower systems.....
....instructors have a key role to draw beginners attention to how bad things can turn.....
...and, I believe it's important to forget about introducing or teaching our friends kite boarding....let the professionals do it!
cwamit
cwamit
WA
1194 posts
WA, 1194 posts
14 Dec 2008 7:33pm

i explain to learners i have taught that ten meters of sail cloth should be seen like holding ten meters of corrigated iron, easy to hold edgeways into the wind, imposible to hold sideways... then explain deathloops.

after saying all that i love riding at the top end of my kites...



Cezar
Cezar
VIC
270 posts
VIC, 270 posts
14 Dec 2008 10:43pm
Even if you come across professional instuctor during your 3 lessons - I presume noone is taking more than that,there is little chance to be told everything that is necesarry to be safe kiteboarder.
I have done my lessons and on top of that I follow this forum in regard to everything that can help me to become better kiteboarder but I still cant find the answer and solution to potentially very serious accident I had few days ago,perhaps some pros can answer some of my questions Im sure it may concern others beginners as well.
Wind 20 knots plus kite 2009 11m , during sliding transition I got unhooked- dont know how it was possible - never happend in my 2 months on water is it possible to put donkey dick wrong?. Next thing I know the kite starts death loops so violantly that I was not able to lift my head above water wind was directly on shore after 70meters the kite was on the beach hit the sand and then I was able to start breathing again after
next loop someone managed to kill it, I was pretty shaken so didnt even thank that guy ,if he does read it thankyou very much.
The questions are is it avoidable ,my leash was hooked to the s/s ring of the left rear line one thing I know now for sure never attach to the ring only to the webbing that way it is impossible to put it by mistake on the wrong ring , but I HAVE BEEN TOLD to attach to the ring.I dont thing I put it on the wrong ring in that case but I didnt have brain to check after, so perhaps this made the kite mad.
Next,should I relise the leash and when .YOU are supposed to do this only in grave danger when I was in the water it was not justified but perhaps on the beach it would be too late ,in this case Iwas very lucky someone was there.
Is it better to ride on suicide I know the kite will not depower so much but the attachment in the centre might prevent kitelooping

when you fire QR or get accidenly unhooked and drop the bar as I did. Thankyou for your response.
Cheers
onstrings
onstrings
QLD
94 posts
QLD, 94 posts
14 Dec 2008 10:42pm
So many surfers die every year, but they do not have a bill board flying above their head which all non users like to blame. Reailty is, its the usual in these type of sports.
Kitehard
Kitehard
WA
2782 posts
WA, 2782 posts
14 Dec 2008 10:22pm
Hey Cezary,

The leash if connected to the steering line, can inadvertently loop up and over the bar end effectively forming a half hitch above the bar which will not let the bar slide away when the safety has been activated.

It is possible that when turning side on to the kite, your chicken loop can slip off the end of the bar hook. if the chicken dick is too short, it can slip out and voila, unhooked!

This is a rare occurance but I have seen it happen in the past, so not that rare.

You were lucky! Steps can be taken to avoid this. Put a heavy cable tie around the spreader and use it as an additional donkey dick but from the spreader not the chicken loop. You could use a Surefire Spreader from SS, you could buy an Ozone Chicken kicket (manufactured version of the cable tie).

No system is infallible ..... none! Just need to keep your wits about you.

A friend of mine I spoke to the other day detailed how he got complacent self landing. He'd done it hundreds of times and had trouble getting the kite to lay down on it's LE. He persisted. The kite bounced, rolled and powered up straight across the Wind window. He was standing on sharp rocks and got thrown 30 feet to land head first on sharp rocks at Margies. Serious cuts and chunks out of his head. He feels lucky and I could hear it in his voice he was really shaken. Said he revisited the site of the accident and felt physically sick when he looked at the impact site. Cheated death this time and he knew it

It can happen to any of us. Always be careful and be aware of your surroundings. Don't put yourself in positions where you are prone to injury if something goes wrong.

Good winds,

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