Herry said...

Back in 1995, my first year out of school, I worked as a clerical trainee for 12 months. 3 days on the job, 2 days at tech. I was paid $382.60/fortnight. I lived at home with my parents, I didn't own my own car, I caught the train to work (an hour and a half each way). That was plenty of money for me. These days kids all have their own cars which require petrol and new tyres each time they smoke 'em up. They're out almost every night drinking or partying so they aren't happy earning an amount similar to what I was on.

Pay apprentices more? You might get more interested kids applying, but are they really going to be suitable employees?

That is the big question.

KEARNSY said...

^^^ Your right Herry paying tradesmen more sounds like a great solution

Anyone ever read a book called "Rich Dad Poor Dad" ??? The shortcut moral of the story is to work for nothing at the start and get it all later.

Have a go at "The Millionaire Next Door" written by Stanley and Danko (both Ph.D.) and "The Millionaire Mind" by Stanley (Danko died) both books published by "Harper Business".

The all time classic favourites are "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnegie and "Think and Grow Rich" by Napoleon Hill.

That is THINK and grow rich, not work and grow rich. You won't get rich without working, but the more thinking you do the less work you will have to do.

The hardest work in the world is THINKING and that is why so few people do it.

cisco said...

Sailhack said...

Finding competent, trustworthy kids that were keen to learn a trade 15 years ago was relatively easy...the last couple of apprentices I trained were hard work, and didn't have the ethics that their predecessors did...

...generational thing? I blame the PARENTS!

Don't blame the parents. Most parents wish a better life on their children than they had.

Blame O.B.E (Outcome Based Education) in which the participant (I am unable to use the words student or pupil in this situation) is shown how to gain a module by answering the obvious of multiple choice answers to loaded questions.

It is a system designed to "dumb down the youth" and escalate the "teacher" up the pay scale.

Cisco buddy...GET SOME SLEEP! 4 posts quoting other's posts shows that you're a little wired! Btw...notice the little 'winking' emoticon?

I don't think apprentices should be paid more...unless their wages are subsidised. To employ & train a 1st year (in my experience only) takes time from the qualified guys which in turn is lost income...honestly, unless you're employing apprentices to do menial tasks (and not training them, which is not the point of apprenticeships) they will cost you well more than they return...that's why the apprenticeship system is a commitment (for employer as well as apprentice) for the 4 year period. Employers need to know that in order to train an apprentice properly, they might not get a return on their investment for 2-3 years!

Another point is that employers generally won't (can't) employ an apprentice until they finish Y12...by the time a kid turns 18, they want the car/girl/plasma tv/etc. When I 'won' my apprenticeship in '89 (each candidate had a weeks trial - no pay, 10 kids applied, 2 at a time), I was 15...$120 a week was GOLD to me! Equivalent now is about $200? Most 18yo's wouldn't get out of bed for that!

stamp said...

you guys parade your low wages like trophies. i see increasing wages as progress, and a better standard of living across the board.

work is a means to an end, and if nowadays you can work less hours for more pay, thus having more time to spend with your family or on the water, and more cash to enjoy it all with, then isn't that the whole idea of a job?

go back to living in a hovel and working in the coal pits 6 days a week 52 weeks a year just to feed your kids bread and gruel if you like. that way you can look tell everybody in the eye and tell them that nobody does it tougher than you.

its about making a life, not a living.

yha thats true you need to be happy. but you also need to enjoy what you do. there is no such thing as a quick buck if you put in the hard yards at the start youll reap the returns 10 fold in years to come. a skill help you to do that which lets us support our familys. for me what i do is no " means to an end" i love what i do have a passion for it yha it has been a tough road but id do it all the same i feel sorry for you if you feel working is a means to an end thats a shame. iv been there done that. going through life with a list of unskilled jobs going no wear thats making a means to an ends fast bucks dont last. i know i dont want my kids to get 20 years down the track to suddenly come to the conclusion that degree thay spent 4 years doing becouse it was less work than becoming a plumber or sparkie or fitter was as usless as tits on a bull to them. i know this will piss some one off but my kids are not growing up becoming professional students...

stamp said...

i run my own welding business and i enjoy my trade, but at the end of the day there are a thousand other things i would rather do with my time than work.

i feel sorry for you if your life is so empty that a career is the major focus. i would never work again if i didn't have to, there is too much to do and see in the world and not enough time as it is.

Sorry for highlighting your post, but it seems to contradict itself...I made a career change to a lower-paid job as a life decision so I could spend more time with my family, so we're on the same track. The difference is, now I'm happy at work & at home, and would much rather spend time with my family, but with kids in school...I'd just be sitting around waiting for wind & getting fat (ter). I love my new career, and it allows me to switch off at night.

Most of us work for a fair chunk of our waking lives, so why not have a career that you love, rather than work in a soul-less job for big bucks...if you can work in a job that you enjoy, that allows you to have all the time with your family that you want & make good coin at the same time...then you've won the jackpot! I'm not bragging about lower salary (that would be a little nuts with windsurfing gear costing what it does!)...just that I've found a balance of work/family life that works well for me and my family, and money wasn't part of that equation.

I agree with you re; upping wages...it's not good that skilled trades are payed as low as they are, and I mentioned above that it's one of the reasons I got out, because I couldn't pay my guys more...as for apprentices, pay them more definitely! But assist the employers so it's not such a huge cost that puts them off training apprentices. I never whinged about my pay when I was an apprentice, but wouldn't have complained if I was paid more!

you guys are right. i think we are on the same page, we are just reading things a little differently.
bottom line is find the right balance and be happy. speaking of which i think that northerly has finally picked up enough to head to the beach....