Hi,

I wanted to start Wingfoiling on my lake in light and gusty winds. So winds in about 5 to max 15kn, if it's more wind I will go windsurfing.
I mainly want to do this in winter, so the water temperature is around 4 ?C (it's a deep cold lake). As in these light winds or because of the shape of the lake it's likely that the wind drops completely.

As a wing, I will choose the Slingwing v2 in 6.4

so now it's the board and foil.
I wanted to use the new Starboard wing board in 6'7 and Lite Tech version (carbon is too much) together with the Starbaord S-Type foil 2400

My local dealer now said, the volume of the board is great and is what you need for my 70kg in such conditions, however, the board is too long. all companies going to create smaller boards. that's why he would recommend me the Fanatic Sky Wing 5'8. same volume but shorter.
Based on reviews I have seen in german said that the starboard has a better lift than other boards of the same size. Also, the Starboard has the foil mount a little more forward. The fanatic one looks more back. I tested a windsurf foil from Slingshot and Starboard last year for around 30 min without any foil experience, and as far as I remember I felt better with the Starboard foil and I think it was also more forward then the slingshot.

The second thing is the foil.
I wanted to select a matching foil, so I choose the new Starboard S-Type foils which they say is made for light wind winging. In size 2400 with 82cm aluminum mast.
Again my dealer said he didn't know the Starbaord foil but he uses the same wing and a 5'8 custom board with a Moses Onal 1100 foil. Not on my lake but on a similar lake close by. He said he doubts the Starboard will be too slow. He said he get foiling with this combo in 10 to 12kn. and as the Moses can, get fast, easy lift up and control he would recommend me that for a carbon one.
What I read in german reviews is that Starboard aluminum foil is nearly as stiff as carbon foil just a little heavier and a little slower top speed.

As I wanted to wing foil (wing foil only, we don't have waves for sup foil on the lake :D ) in hopefully even lighter wind (though about 7 8kn)
I think that speed is not the point. Instead to increase time on the water in winter times, easy lift up, and stay up in light wind is most needed. In case I wanted to do wing foiling in stronger winds starting from 14kn on, I thought I still can buy additional smaller front wings for the foil.

What would you recommend and why?

thanks a lot.

interesting, as all I heard so far is that wings perform very well also in light winds. :/lots of people who Wingfoil say that in the beginning, they need around 12kn, but after they know how to pump they get flying in 8kn or even 6kn wind. :/ The reason why I wanted to Wingfoil in lighter winds is that it should be easier and less exhausting. As I wanted to do it mainly in winter times, when strong winds make it even colder, I wanted to go out in the light wind. So I can sail with gloves (Windsurfing with gloves is a pain for me, so either my fingers get frozen or I'm exhausted after 2 to 4 runs) and can enjoy it for at least an hour or so.

WST,

I have heard that 6-8knot claim too, but have yet to see it in person. I know better than to be fooled by Instagram edits that are staged to look super light. The day I get passed by a full-sized adult male wingfoiler who gets going in 6-8 knots and sails comfortably is the day I pack in my sails for good. I hope it happens, but am not holding my breath. For now all I see and experience is a downwind waste of time in these winds. Maybe it's just that the wingers where I live rig for higher winds and aren't great in light winds yet (like me), but it's always Moth sailors in about 7 knots the ram air foil kiters at 8 or 9 knots, the windfoilers at 12 knots and the wingers at 15 knots before they can get going recently on foil. YMMV.??

yes I know I need gloves, but as I don't have to make pressure on a boom, I expect it should be easier. Let's say I can hold a bottle of water up in the air with gloves as long as without, but if I need to make pressure on something, with gloves I'm exhausted fast.

I tried already a lot of windsurf gloves. the only ones that at least help very minimal for the windchill are the ones with the open inside hand.
I also use the slimes boom available on the market, custom made as with thicker booms I get exhausted faster. (just freeriding in medium winds doesn't matter, but when going for speed overpowered is where I feel a big difference)

but why would you two go windfoil instead of wingfoil is light wind? I head that pumping to get on the foil is easier with the wing. as such you can wing in even lighter winds.
Means, I heard the following:

1. should be easier to lift up
2. should be easier to control
3. should be easier for jibes
4. you can go in lighter winds.
5. less stuff to carry (in summer doesn't matter, but when it's cold and raining, etc. I think it's worth to have this in mind)
6. bigger wind range
7. easier to handle in strong gusts

sorry for all the questions, but there are not so many reviews and reports out there, and the stuff you need isn't cheap.

Agree. I don't wing in anything less than 10-11 knots. Unfortunately, most of the days at my local seldom get above 13 knots, which means average wind speeds are a few knots less. So you could say it's not very windy for where I live. For these conditions, kiters and kite foilers pass by like fighter jets. I've seen experienced guys get up on foil when I was not, but they also were not in the water very long. At some point, I too will get into kiting but at the moment will continue to focus on winging a cpl days a week. There is just enough wind to make it interesting and still be fun.

ok on my lake kiting is not possible as you always need to start in the wood.

I asked gleiten.tv and he said. wingfoiling and windfoiling will start at the same speed. It's just the Olympic class windfoil with very wide boards and big sails that get a little earlier to fly.

in case of safety I agree that windfoil will be safer. I think for my lake it doesn't matter that much, as the maximum distance I would need to paddle is 250m in worst case and 500m in a still ok case. and I can be picked up all around the lake. But it's still the point with less gear to carry, and easier to learn. oh man ...

My guess is if you start winging you will not windfoil after a month.To answer your question both setup are great and both foil are great.
Both board are great, yes the 6'7" is a bit long, but I guess if you want to go in ocean and use it as a sup foil it could be a better option.

I would pick the lightest setup of both. If you want to lift off in very light wind, weight is your enemy in my opinion.

If you are not tall a 6'4 wing will be hard at first, wing tips will drag in the water a lot.I'm 75kg, can wing in about 10kts right now with a 5.0 and a 1800cm2 front wing....I sold my windfoil gear. The day I saw dudes riging and riging sails because wind started at 10kts..then incresed to 15, then increased to 22kts...and I was still on the same setup while everyone was swaping sail....I said to myself forget about it! Now when I go to the cottage, I bring one bag(inflatable board) and whatever the wind is...it fits in a bag, no need for 3 sails, 2 mast and 2 booms....I windsurf elsewhere when wind is stronger and condition are fun.

If wind do shut down completely, volume is wise and if there is a lot of chops, longer board is easier to stand up and wait for next gust.

Hang loose and good luck.

You said 5-15kts and above that you windsurf.
So for windfoiling all you need is a foil, chances are one of your existing boards will work fine.

Winging will require a full setup.

I've been windfoiling a while and even at 90kg I can foil in 10-12kts with a 6.3m.
I can also cruise easily one handed to get circulation back in the other on really cold days.

Most wingers I know, who are lighter than me, don't bother getting on the water unless its +15kts.
They are getting excellent range from their wings but it's all up top, not the bottom end.

Wing gear isn't any more compact if you are also bringing windsurf gear.

None of your boards are powerbox, tuttle or deep tuttle?

Good luck on the one handed winging, that's pro level stuff. Pretty easy on windfoil.

Locally we have a lot of kiters, then windfoilers and now slowly wingers. But nobody wings in less than 15kts where we have lots of kites and windfoilers flying around. A few still windsurf if its +25kts but most still windfoil.

It's the same here, the wind foilers who passed to wing foil sold their wind foil gear or don't use it anymore...and they are on wing in 8-10 knts and more. If you never foiled...it will be a bit harder at first to master the foil. I think you might learn quicker on the 6'7 since you will mainly relies on boat speed...the shorter board might be harder to maintain direction and generate boat speed. When you become better, you generate more power by pumping the foil and need a lot less boat speed. However the fanatic, more compact is a board you will probably keep longer, you might want to reduce length after a while.

NordRoi said..
It's the same here, the wind foilers who passed to wing foil sold their wind foil gear or don't use it anymore...and they are on wing in 8-10 knts and more. If you never foiled...it will be a bit harder at first to master the foil. I think you might learn quicker on the 6'7 since you will mainly relies on boat speed...the shorter board might be harder to maintain direction and generate boat speed. When you become better, you generate more power by pumping the foil and need a lot less boat speed. However the fanatic, more compact is a board you will probably keep longer, you might want to reduce length after a while.

i think with 181cm the 6.4 shouldn't be a problem. also the slingwing v2 have in all sizes the same width

hm, but did anyone know the wights of the boards and the foils?
somehow all the informations are missing.

so you would also say that for my weight of 70kg the 2100sqaure cm will produce the same lift as the 2400, but will be easier to control in little stronger winds ?

johndg said..
Hi WST, I am replying regarding the power in different wind locations. The difference between northern Europe and say Australia is the amount of moisture in the air. In Europe this means that the air is denser and therefore has more power than Australia. Therefore 15 knots in Britain is equivalent to 20 knots in Australia.

I read about his many years ago on Australian sailors racing in Britain and having to spend time adjusting to the increased power in the wind.

I get up here on a Wing Foil in around 12 knots but in Europe I would be able to get on the foil in less wind.

thank you very much, that's what I thought,

Good point JonathanC. Both boards are the same width and the fanatic is heavy as well. Definitely more stable the starboard.

For wind density, dryer air is more dense BUT colder air is more as well, so maybe that was the main factor when sailing in UK? When I visited Australia in summer, I was back from a 4months trip on Maui and wind was better than maui in my opinion, less gusty on your east coast. I visited from Cains to Adelaide, what a beautiful country and amazing playground!!! My Icon or picture that you sea in the left corner beside my name was taken in Brunswick Head.

If I'm correct that the Moses 1100 is 2100, there is not much difference in a 2100 vs 2400cm2 foil.

interesting, where did you found the weight on the starboard page? could you please share the link? maybe ist just Australien page and not the german one :/

yes, it's the same as with windsurfing, big is beautiful :D

Yes, the Moses 1100 is 2100cm2 , Moses and I Think Armstrong using the width of the wings and not cm2.

so 1100 is a huge span. it's 10cm more than the starboard 2400.

I currently more to the Moses foil, as it's cheaper than the starboard carbon version, and only the carbon version is swimming. (heard to much about people losing their foils ... )
and for me, it looks more flexible.
For Starboard I can exchange the front wing and the back wing. but I can't change the fuselage, and also it looks like I can't buy the front wing separately. (maybe because it's new and no one offers it yet :/ ) but one I will add a smaller front wing in the future, the Moses wll be even cheaper compared to Starboard aluminum version.

Here is the link, just scroll down to the bottom of this page and there is a chart including estimated weights

sup.star-board.com/wing-board/wingboard-foil/

As far as I know all the 2021 Starboard foils have an extra locking screw to prevent the potential foil loss. The upside of their system is the simplicity of setting up the foils, so much easier and faster. The rear foil / stabilizer can have the angle changed easily without shims. Two different fuselage lengths are offered. Not sure about the option of buying different foils individually, guess that may be market specific and up to the importer in Germany.

It occurred to me over the past few days there are more nuances to perceived wind speed when wing foiling. At my local spot on Weds I struggled but did much better the following day. After looking at the wind speeds, they were not so different. Weds the peak speed was 10 knots, Thurs 11 knots. Thursday did have much less variability. I also made it a point on Thurs to start in a slightly different spot, upwind from Weds location. The spot is more bowl shaped by the shore and seemed to do a better job at funneling the wind. My point is we get caught up in saying winging can only be performed at X knots, but there may be more to it and be influenced by local factors.