Council ban kitting lessons at woodies

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Shan
Shan
WA
129 posts
WA, 129 posts
15 Feb 2013 7:06am
Read the article here http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/article/16149436

From what I have heard through the grapevine it was only a matter of time before this was to happen!
eppo
eppo
WA
9793 posts
WA, 9793 posts
15 Feb 2013 7:13am
There is a silver lining there. But I do feel sorry for the schools that have been there a while and have been doing the right thing.
kiter2007
kiter2007
WA
102 posts
WA, 102 posts
15 Feb 2013 8:23am
I have kited down woodies for the past 5 years. It's not the schools that cause the problems. It's the dickheads that teach their mates after starting the sport and barely able to kite them self's. I would also be extremely surprised if we see a ranger on the beach. All rangers/security avoid that place as much as possible
Underoath
Underoath
QLD
2434 posts
QLD, 2434 posts
15 Feb 2013 10:24am
So there is this......
The council last night voted unanimously to support a ban on dozens of operators who have crowded the foreshore, near Coogee, over the past two years, many without formal qualifications or insurance.


Then there is this
Caroline Bradley from Elemental Surf:

"We've been trying to get a permit there for eight years
.............................................................................................................


Whats wrong with this picture?





ApatheticEnd
ApatheticEnd
WA
995 posts
WA, 995 posts
15 Feb 2013 9:19am
I'd be amazed to see a ranger down there enforcing this. So if an instructor just says "nah bra, I'm just showing my mate here how it's done" he's alright? Stupid.

So they've banned qualified instruction at woodies?
cutch
cutch
WA
67 posts
WA, 67 posts
15 Feb 2013 9:21am
Just to clarify, the ban is on teaching not kiting right?
sci
sci
WA
762 posts
sci sci
WA, 762 posts
15 Feb 2013 9:26am
ApatheticEnd said...
I'd be amazed to see a ranger down there enforcing this. So if an instructor just says "nah bra, I'm just showing my mate here how it's done" he's alright? Stupid.

So they've banned qualified instruction at woodies?


I would not be surprised at all. The rangers make themselves very visible when required. I guarantee this has been led by either a pissed off kiter, a member of the public or the schools themselves.

The other note here is that I see schools teaching on beach 2 as well (you know who you are) which is just plain stupidity and you should be ashamed of yourselves!

You think the councils are not reading these forums?

All up I think it had to happen and it will continue to happen until things get regulated in a professional manner.

The schools unfortunately pay the biggest price but again this season has seen the spawn of a very ugly budget instructors operating from the boots of their cars, selling lessons to the uneducated via gumtree and the kooks teaching there mates.

Perhaps now a more professional approach can be taken and stamped by authority.

There is most certainly a future in kitesurfing schools but it needs to be done properly with the upmost professionalism, safety standards and not to the detriment of other beach goers.
JimJones
JimJones
QLD
237 posts
QLD, 237 posts
15 Feb 2013 12:00pm
All other councils will see this example.

Get the house in order, "self govern" or someone will for you.
the gibbo
the gibbo
WA
776 posts
WA, 776 posts
15 Feb 2013 11:20am
Underoath said...
So there is this......
The council last night voted unanimously to support a ban on dozens of operators who have crowded the foreshore, near Coogee, over the past two years, many without formal qualifications or insurance.


Then there is this
Caroline Bradley from Elemental Surf:

"We've been trying to get a permit there for eight years
.............................................................................................................


Whats wrong with this picture?








I feel sorry for these guys also, never had a problem with them at all.
I too have kited there 3/4+ years and its just got silly, self regulation is not possible and council dont understand the sport so cant really regulate it either.

There are solid arguments that its a terrible place to teach anyway, mistakes close inshore are punished by the drag on the beach, its to onshore, but the lack of joe public is good. No ideal place i guess.

I see rangers there all the time but i dont think i remember one getting of thier car.

All they have to do is set up a teaching zone, 250m or so south(beach 1) off the main launch/land zone job done. There is parking and guess what, the wind doesnt stop ALL the way down the beach, amazing, we dont all have to kite on top of eachother.
Good luck all, it a s??t storm of some of the "schools" own making.
moon waxing
moon waxing
WA
313 posts
WA, 313 posts
15 Feb 2013 11:21am
Inevitable I suppose.

I wished the schools would make an effort to contribute to the beach state rather than just take. I go out of my way to pick up any rubbish (always plenty) and dispose of in the bin at beach 1, though there's a smell from hell when you open the lid.

The kite beaches in Egypt the guys would even rake the sand to remove gnarly shells in the slack time.
default
default
WA
1255 posts
WA, 1255 posts
15 Feb 2013 11:43am
moon waxing said...

The kite beaches in Egypt the guys would even rake the sand to remove gnarly shells in the slack time.



um, yeah Egypt is a lovely place to be
toddws
toddws
WA
469 posts
WA, 469 posts
15 Feb 2013 12:46pm
Now what happens? Bedlam at Point Walter, Carnage at Melville, This does no good for anyone
Number
Number
WA
108 posts
WA, 108 posts
15 Feb 2013 12:48pm
Why stop at teaching? Why not ban kiting overall at beach1?

Now it will be plenty of beginners but no one there to help them out when they mess up.
GalahOnTheBay
GalahOnTheBay
NSW
4188 posts
NSW, 4188 posts
15 Feb 2013 4:11pm
Shan said...

Read the article here au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/article/16149436

From what I have heard through the grapevine it was only a matter of time before this was to happen!


If by this you mean only a matter of time until the council finds a way to cash in and make money then yes I agree...

au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/article/16149436
said...

Surf school operators will now have to find an alternative location until the council develops a formal licensing policy for the operators
dalestanton
dalestanton
WA
272 posts
WA, 272 posts
15 Feb 2013 1:14pm
This is a classic example for us to get behind WAKSA, and WAKSA assisting the sport to keep access open for kiters and professional instruction. That's half the reason tehy were formed. It's only going to get bigger, I've seen the sport go from nothing to gang busters over the last 10 years. The best thing is there are people in high up places who support the sport, which is helpful because many councils listen to the loudest voice, the complainers. Many valid points s, but there is always the minority who ruin it for the rest of us. Happens in all sports.

Hopefully this can be resolved professionally.

bennie
bennie
ACT
1258 posts
ACT, 1258 posts
15 Feb 2013 4:24pm
WA one of the most sparsely populated areas on earth. One of the most crowded kiting locations in the world.
Akwa
Akwa
WA
255 posts
WA, 255 posts
15 Feb 2013 1:28pm
Myeah I suppose that was a matter of time...

Sad for the licensed Kiteschools there.

Hopefully the unlicensed schools wont move their business to Safety Bay..
the walks
the walks
WA
448 posts
WA, 448 posts
15 Feb 2013 1:42pm
Akwa said...
Myeah I suppose that was a matter of time...

Sad for the licensed Kiteschools there.

Hopefully the unlicensed schools wont move their business to Safety Bay..


There are NO licenced schools there, putting a bit more thought into this
Perhaps someone has a plan and the first stage to getting a permit is to get a total ban then council permit operator only Just a thought
coldshot
coldshot
WA
218 posts
WA, 218 posts
15 Feb 2013 1:55pm
5 Years to go and this sport will be like JET skiing ONLY certain spots to go to and that's going to be the end of this sport on the SWAN RIVER.

Saw 2 ppl trying to teach their friends at PELI yesterday one was in the NO GO area the whole time and 2 girls were just off the launch area getting in the way where everyone likes to pose with their jumps!!

Only 5 years to go tops!!!
THE DONG
THE DONG
VIC
518 posts
VIC, 518 posts
15 Feb 2013 5:04pm
bennie said...
WA one of the most sparsely populated areas on earth. One of the most crowded kiting locations in the world.


they all kite together in the theory "the more kiters around me the smaller the odds are that ill get bum****ed by white death"
dbabicwa
dbabicwa
WA
809 posts
WA, 809 posts
15 Feb 2013 2:05pm
coldshot said...
5 Years to go and this sport will be like JET skiing ONLY certain spots to go to and that's going to be the end of this sport on the SWAN RIVER.

Saw 2 ppl trying to teach their friends at PELI yesterday one was in the NO GO area the whole time and 2 girls were just off the launch area getting in the way where everyone likes to pose with their jumps!!

Only 5 years to go tops!!!



Nah, must be 4 years now, since last year you're saying 5:)
default
default
WA
1255 posts
WA, 1255 posts
15 Feb 2013 2:10pm
bennie said...
WA one of the most sparsely populated areas on earth. One of the most crowded kiting locations in the world.


While its entertaining to watch the eastern staters consistently encompass its capital city kiting issues on the whole of WA, the comments are usually highly inaccurate, or plain ignorant

WA, one of the most crowded kiting locations in the world?.. hardly

A more accurate statement would probably be..

Perth metro, one of the highest kiter per capita densities in the world

I kite alone mostly
herbyburger
herbyburger
WA
303 posts
WA, 303 posts
15 Feb 2013 2:52pm
The "Point" is back ON.
Been missing the inside shore run since the schools took over..
Seriously, the writing was on the wall, is this a suprise for the kite schools?
way too many schools in a small area in
amongst local and tourist riders.
You guys should have worked things out together before it got to this.
Why werent the schools getting heavy with the "Rouge instructors".
Its way easy for you guys to spot the teacher intruders.
You guys should be out to protect your area.
Like other local riders I too spend time picking up rubbish and junk from
the ocean every time I kite there then put in the bin which helped lobby for., I have never seen the schools put anything back into that beach.
Its a huge wake up call, Beach1 would run fine with one or maybe 2 schools MAX!
Both located half way down the beach in one of the carprks half way down the beach. The amount of times ive knocked off work 4pm to have a quick sesh to find no carparking because F--ing Kite Schools has taken up X bays with trailers and gear, Lots of bays half way down where you were meant to be.
I dont feel sorry for the schools, brought it on by yourselfs...
I just hope that you help keep "The Point" OPEN for ALL now that youve f"d up
beach1..
kitesasspro
kitesasspro
6 posts
6 posts
15 Feb 2013 4:00pm
No such thing as legitimate schools down there, one school stealing students from the next, why is anyone suprised.
Someone gets badly injured, and all the schools are pointing the fingers at the euros and saying 'well its cause of them'.
Wakey Wakey Jokers, you're all in the same boat, euros, drunkard school owners, mates teaching mates, you're all as dangerous as each other.
And now you're all crying into your jack daniels bottles.
Where's RPM when you need him for a proper rant, thumb away losers!!
JimJones
JimJones
QLD
237 posts
QLD, 237 posts
15 Feb 2013 7:38pm
So I would bet that at the council they first thought they could ban all kiting down there, but realised they could only ban the schools (ie the council can control/ban commercial activity within its bounds).

Indeed, does council jurisdiction extend into the water at all? If it doesn't then they can only ban commercial operations on land.... hence this outcome..

When I've been down at Woodies (my local), students have probably only made up ~25% of the traffic, so its not going to make a very big difference to the locals is it?
airjunkie
airjunkie
WA
142 posts
WA, 142 posts
15 Feb 2013 5:55pm
bennie said...
WA one of the most sparsely populated areas on earth. One of the most crowded kiting locations in the world.


your kidding yourself - far from any one of the most crowded in the world

people are just developing this view due to the exponential growth over the past decade but this growth is happening globally especially due to the fact the sport is not much more than a decade old itself

in Tarrifa for one example they literally cue up on the beaches waiting to get on the water
I've also seen beaches in England in the off season with around 150+ kites on the water in less than average conditions

due to the relatively new nature of the sport is is up to those who participate in it to help the councils and the public understand the sport and to develop a way forward for these situations - no one else will do it for us !
The councils will just use a knee jerk reaction and ban it outright location by location council by council

Ive been through it and had my local spot closed down by a local council we the kiters got together and spent time and effort to eventually have the ban lifted and plans of action and protocols put in place

And JimJones weather or not they have the power to ban it at a location at the moment doesn't mean anything - it doesn't take long to change the legislation trust me if they want it banned they will make it happen.
As someone else has already posted (and from my own experience with previous bans and the related forum discussion) they the council's do read these forums so there is no need to provoke them by saying you just won't listen to their decision !
Can't you see how retarded that point of view is and that it just shows us kiters as being irresponsible and untrustworthy

Please for the sake of the sport don't give them ammunition to take things further at this location or any other one

There's my rant for the day

iti
iti
QLD
417 posts
iti iti
QLD, 417 posts
15 Feb 2013 10:07pm
herbyburger said...
The "Point" is back ON.
Been missing the inside shore run since the schools took over..
Seriously, the writing was on the wall, is this a suprise for the kite schools?
way too many schools in a small area in
amongst local and tourist riders.
You guys should have worked things out together before it got to this.
Why werent the schools getting heavy with the "Rouge instructors".
Its way easy for you guys to spot the teacher intruders.
You guys should be out to protect your area.
Like other local riders I too spend time picking up rubbish and junk from
the ocean every time I kite there then put in the bin which helped lobby for., I have never seen the schools put anything back into that beach.
Its a huge wake up call, Beach1 would run fine with one or maybe 2 schools MAX!
Both located half way down the beach in one of the carprks half way down the beach. The amount of times ive knocked off work 4pm to have a quick sesh to find no carparking because F--ing Kite Schools has taken up X bays with trailers and gear, Lots of bays half way down where you were meant to be.
I dont feel sorry for the schools, brought it on by yourselfs...
I just hope that you help keep "The Point" OPEN for ALL now that youve f"d up
beach1..


agreed this has been on the cards for a long time,what i read into it is that no lessons including 1/1 with mates - ranges will be down here inforcing this 100%
Number
Number
WA
108 posts
WA, 108 posts
15 Feb 2013 9:02pm
What is the definition of teaching in the ban?

Someone in the water with a harness but not a kite?

Commercial activity at the beach? (no more demo days...)

Or does it extend to all learners? (=all non IKO certified kiters)

herbyburger said...
The amount of times ive knocked off work 4pm to have a quick sesh to find no carparking because F--ing Kite Schools has taken up X bays with trailers and gear.


Then maybe the ban have to be extended to cover everyone but you? To make sure that your private parking bay is free...
coldshot
coldshot
WA
218 posts
WA, 218 posts
15 Feb 2013 9:22pm
This ban looks like what happened to the personal trainers in parks, as they were making money and using council land the council stepped in and hit the personal trainers with a fee to use the park. looks like this is going to happen to our industry too!

I thought the beaches were FREE, not anymore!!
the walks
the walks
WA
448 posts
WA, 448 posts
15 Feb 2013 10:05pm
[abuse removed] read my previous post and stop bleeting, council does nothing over night, it take months for them to even talk to each other let alone ban something, this has been planed for a while for whatever the reasons are
busterwa
busterwa
3782 posts
3782 posts
15 Feb 2013 10:22pm
Cockburn council are a bunch of incompetent ****en muppets. They should of acknowledged and given a permit to competent kite instructors long before now and imposed a management plan. To be honest alot of instructors would enforce/manage unsafe practices at and work for the council

Insted of dealing with the problem and managing it they have taken a were cop-out approach washed the hands of all liability leagally .Smart move by the pencil pushers but not a resolution to the problem.

They wont patrol it they dont need to . But if anyone injureds a second party the can be held negligent.They have put the emphasis back onto the puppet holding the strings.

Implementation and acknowledgement of competent insured instructors to facilitate training should of been done long ago. I also believe some kitesurfing instructors could work with local councils rangers to remove unsafe practices along the beach.
A ranger who is untrained/unskilled in kitesurfing is surely not competent to hand out fines to kitesurfers. . A trained kite-surfing instructor is.

I think a permit/liscencing type of system will probably be implemented in the shire of cockburn and other shires

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