I think your point is valid Saffer, but I don't think anyone really takes it that seriously.....there really are much more difficult things for them to try and deal with. Just a thought on a sad day because I put my heal through my fish, but it is all good...shows I tried But this comment don't matter because its from another country.

Amazing that they can take this stuff seriously, what is the world coming to...in Vic. at least. We really have had very good relations with our government here on most kiting matters...very reasonable and good people. It is good for people to be on the water together doing sport....they get along pretty well really. They are not out to get us or anyone else.....just wish they would do something about the crims.

because of the fn needless stupid behaviour of a minority of kiter's

Hear hear

gruezi said...

I think your point is valid Saffer, but I don't think anyone really takes it that seriously.....there really are much more difficult things for them to try and deal with. Just a thought on a sad day because I put my heal through my fish, but it is all good...shows I tried But this comment don't matter because its from another country.

Unfortunately comments can be taken out of context Gruezi.

Something written on a forum with tongue in cheek can be brought up at a council meeting or public forum with no reference to the poster's original intention.

If it is in some way derogatory to the public or other beach users it can be presented as "this is how the kiting community think" and in turn used against us.

Saffer is correct, care should be taken about what is posted to avoid the potential of a bad post being used to reinforce the reason for action being taken against us.

During the struggle/contest/battle to maintain access at Mullaloo two years ago, the 'anti-kiting' community group did their research - they read comments made here and relied on other kiting sites (from memory, a 'kitemare' specific site) as part of their argument in favour of bans.

The 'anti-kiting' group reported on the attitude of kiters towards bans/the council/ & comments made about individuals within the 'anti-kiting' group in their submissions to the City of Joondalup.

It's obvious (to me at least) that there isn't much connection between comments made by/from WA kiters having a significant impact on Victorian/NSW/Qld/SA/Tas issues, but Saffer has a point - play the ball, not the person(s) trying to restrict our sport.

Maybe people should stop writting so many threads about bans.

I agree with Saffer. Personal attacks on anyone,particularly someone who has an issue with kiters, will only polarise and inflame matters. Sexist and racist comments are also obviously unacceptable .

Think about what you post like this. Your comments could be cited as evidence as they are in the public domain . Would you personally want to appear at a court session or council meeting to explain them?

Also note that attempts at humour online are often misinterpreted .

and here I am thinking I live in AUSTRALIA, not Afganistan. coz surely to god they dont have people telling them what they can and cant write on THE INTERNET! you know, that big 'ol thing were people have a right to say what they want?


If someone on here is looking for "ammo" or whatnot to use agianst the kiting community to enforce bans and so on, chances are they are already realy effing pissed off!!!

Red thumb away, its the internet and im not loosing any sleep over this. . . . .

I also agree with Saffer, and disagree with Shayne. Shayne, the internet is a bigger, more mainstream part of our modern lives than it was in 1986. The relevant part of it, the World Wide Web, came into being in about 1990, so it's now around 22 years old. It's accessible to a significant portion of the world's population and to claim that it isn't important just isn't true any more. It is an accepted means of communication and a tool for information sharing like no other.

In line with a mature internet, we are trying to keep this a mature website when maturity is required. This doesn't conflict with our mission statement of keeping it fun. It can be appropriate fun, or inappropriate fun. When things get inappropriate we moderate, and from now on we will be taking a harder line on moderation of serious matters such as the one in question. We will be banning people much more readily from now on when they write stupid things that impact other people's access to kite spots.

Shayne86 said...

...that big 'ol thing were people have a right to say what they want?

You have a right to say to me on here what you would say to me in person. No more and no less.

banning and moderating is just a band-aid fix. the problem is actual real life people, not keyboard warriors, that are ruining certain beaches for you metro guys and girls.

I clearly dont understand your problems because I live in a small town were we can all get along with no issues and no disgruntled beach users. Australia has unlimted amounts of coastline, is it realy that hard to find a nice quiet beach were you arent gonna piss someone off???

Shayne,

Banning and moderating is cure. People not putting up ill-considered and inappropriate postings is prevention.

There are sometimes over a hundred kiter out at some locations in Melbourne. Its not so easy to find a quiet beach here, particularly for beginners.

The key issue is that some "keyboard warriors" are posting inappropriate negative comments relating to complaints and members of the public that can result in us completely losing using access to some locations.

Nothing good will come from this behaviour, and losing locations will REALLY piss off a lot of kiters, myself included.

Oris said...

Are we actually aloud to complain about the public.

We all kite in 200 meter area at Brighton and you always get a few swimmers and
surfers that go out right in the middle of our zone.

They have the entire beach to swim but pick that area.

Maybe they are the ones complaining.

I think its time we complain about them.

Depends on whether swimming is excluded in this areas. In all the Vic kiting areas, zoned watersports areas for kiting do not exclude swimming.

Oris said...

Are we actually aloud to complain about the public.

We all kite in 200 meter area at Brighton and you always get a few swimmers and
surfers that go out right in the middle of our zone.

They have the entire beach to swim but pick that area.

Sigh..

This is the attitude that constantly amazes me.

Yes - I understand it takes a 'special' kind of person to think it is a good idea to wade out in an area with 20-30 kites operating and not think that it might be hazardous..

But the thing that sticks with me about comments like the one above is the terratorial claim that it is 'our' spot.

So how did it become our spot exactly?

Brighton was a windsurfing spot for decades before kiters shoved their way in.
It was/is a popular surfing spot for a long time before that.
And it has been a very popular swimming spot a LOT longer.

That's why there is a kn big carpark adjacent.. no coz it would make surfing/sailing/kiting more accessible.

Whilst you might say "Why don't the punters go up the beach a few hundred metres" (to the kite/sail exclusion area)..when you stop to consider that there is 4km of relatively vacant beach to the south of Brighton I think the "our spot - fk orf" philosophy becomes laughable.. and selfish.

We have kilometres of open spaces to choose from - a lot like Woodies I can't fathom why so many choose to go out a a small spot..

Same goes for landing right in the walkway - or north or walkway after a downwinder. Ami I missing out on free beers by landing 50m south before the walkway or sumpin??



Brighton is an area not excluded and available for kiting - as it is for ALL other non-excluded activities.

That's the bit that unfortunately doesn't seem to register with most kiters.



If Joe public chooses (unwisely IMO) to wade out into the Brighton surf on a 20kt arvo (likely as it is his/her only opportunity to get out there for the week or similar) then bully for us.

We are the ones opperating the gear capable of taking someone's head off - we have to make damn sure we expect others to be out there and ride accordingly.

less talk on the forums and more action at the beach. Being seen doing the right thing will go along way in situations like this.

Sabotage

I hardly can believe the councils would be so narrow minded to judge a community based on individual forum posts.

On SB (and other forums) everyone is representing a virtual individual (usually with no name or accountability), and no one represents the community.

Provocative posts may originate from non kiters public trying to prove their points.

Only a narrow minority of the kite boarding community posts on this forum.

The real danger, if any, is the "righteousness" of a few individual kiters and forum members who are notoriously airing incidents of "misbehaving" and unrespectful kiters who are "so dangerous to the public". These posts may stoke the fire to burn us.... or ban us.... so just stop being so right, and do something on the beaches...

Bans are the cheapest easiest way for the councils to resolve conflicts of interest, and they are always against the minority... it's called bullying. This attitude of the councils leads to a society where there are only two alternatives of activities: one which is compulsory, and another which is banned.

I still hope, there are intelligent individuals in the councils who understand the nature of the internet public forums and don't jump into conclusions by individual posts. And I also hope, that there are many council officials dedicated to create a free and peaceful society rather than bullying the minorities to get the support of the majorities..... I wish I could have written "know" instead of "hope"....